Cabinet
Affairs |
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2 T H E C A B I N E T
3 S T A T E O F F L O R I D A
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Representing:
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STATE BOARD OF ADMINISTRATION
6 DIVISION OF BOND FINANCE
STATE BOARD OF EDUCATION
7 STATE BOARD OF CAREER EDUCATION
ADMINISTRATION COMMISSION
8 TRUSTEES OF THE INTERNAL
IMPROVEMENT TRUST FUND
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10 The above agencies came to be heard before
THE FLORIDA CABINET, Honorable Governor Chiles
11 presiding, in the Cabinet Meeting Room, LL-03,
The Capitol, Tallahassee, Florida, on Thursday,
12 March 28, 1996, commencing at approximately 9:50 a.m.
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15 Reported by:
16 LAURIE L. GILBERT
Registered Professional Reporter
17 Certified Court Reporter
Notary Public in and for
18 the State of Florida at Large
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21 ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.
100 SALEM COURT
22 TALLAHASSEE, FLORIDA 32301
904/878-2221
23 1-800/934-9090
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1 APPEARANCES:
2 Representing the Florida Cabinet:
3 LAWTON CHILES
Governor
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BOB CRAWFORD
5 Commissioner of Agriculture
6 BOB MILLIGAN
Comptroller
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SANDRA B. MORTHAM
8 Secretary of State
9 BOB BUTTERWORTH
Attorney General
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BILL NELSON
11 Treasurer
12 FRANK T. BROGAN
Commissioner of Education
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ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.
March 28, 1996
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1 I N D E X
2 ITEM ACTION PAGE
3 STATE BOARD OF ADMINISTRATION:
(Presented by Ash Williams, Jr.,
4 Executive Director)
5 1 Approved 6
2 Approved 6
6 3 Approved 7
4 Approved 7
7 5 Approved 7
6 Approved 7
8 7 Approved 8
9 DIVISION OF BOND FINANCE:
(Presented by J. Ben Watkins, III,
10 Director)
11 1 Approved 9
2 Approved 9
12 3 Approved 9
4 Approved 10
13 5 Approved 13
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ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.
March 28, 1996
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1 I N D E X
(Continued)
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ITEM ACTION PAGE
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STATE BOARD OF EDUCATION:
4 (Presented by Robert L. Bedford, Ph.D.,
Deputy Commissioner)
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1 Report 15
6 2 Deferred 19
3 Deferred 19
7 4 Approved 20
5 Approved 20
8 6 Approved 21
7 Approved 21
9 8 Approved 21
9 Approved 22
10 10 Approved 22
11 Approved 22
11 12 Approved 24
13 Approved 24
12 14 Approved 24
15 Approved 25
13 16 Approved 25
17 Approved 25
14 18 Approved 26
19 Approved 26
15 20 Approved 26
21 Approved 27
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STATE BOARD OF CAREER EDUCATION:
17 (Presented by Robert L. Bedford, Ph.D.,
Deputy Commissioner)
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1 Approved 28
19 2 Approved 28
20 ADMINISTRATION COMMISSION:
(Presented by Robert B. Bradley, Ph.D.,
21 Secretary)
22 1 Approved 29
2A and 2B Approved 29
23 3 Approved 29
4 Approved 93
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ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.
March 28, 1996
5
1 I N D E X
(Continued)
2
ITEM ACTION PAGE
3
BOARD OF TRUSTEES OF THE
4 INTERNAL IMPROVEMENT
TRUST FUND:
5 (Presented by Virginia B. Wetherell,
Secretary)
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1 Approved 95
7 2 Approved 95
3 Approved 95
8 4 Approved 96
5 Approved 96
9 6 Approved 96
7 Approved 96
10 8 Approved 97
9 Approved 97
11 10 Approved 97
11 Approved 98
12 12 Approved 98
13 Approved 98
13 14 Approved 124
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CERTIFICATE OF REPORTER 129
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ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.
STATE BOARD OF ADMINISTRATION
March 28, 1996
6
1 P R O C E E D I N G S
2 (The agenda items commenced at 10:28 a.m.)
3 GOVERNOR CHILES: State Board of
4 Administration.
5 MR. WILLIAMS: Item 1 is the minutes of the
6 March 12 meeting.
7 TREASURER NELSON: Motion.
8 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Motion.
9 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved --
10 TREASURER NELSON: Second.
11 GOVERNOR CHILES: -- and seconded.
12 Without objection, the minutes are
13 approved.
14 MR. WILLIAMS: Item 2 is a fiscal
15 sufficiency for the Board of Regents,
16 Florida A&M student apartment facility revenue
17 bonds.
18 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Motion.
19 TREASURER NELSON: Second.
20 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
21 Without objection, they're approved.
22 MR. WILLIAMS: Item 3 is a fiscal
23 sufficiency for DOT right-of-way acquisition and
24 bridge construction refunding bonds.
25 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Motion.
ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.
STATE BOARD OF ADMINISTRATION
March 28, 1996
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1 TREASURER NELSON: Second.
2 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
3 Without objection, that's approved.
4 MR. WILLIAMS: Item 4 is an interest rate
5 exception for the Overoaks Community Development
6 District.
7 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Motion.
8 TREASURER NELSON: Second.
9 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
10 Without objection, that's approved.
11 MR. WILLIAMS: Item 5 is an appointment to
12 the Florida Hurricane Catastrophe Fund Advisory
13 Council.
14 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: I move this.
15 TREASURER NELSON: Second.
16 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
17 Without objection, it's approved.
18 MR. WILLIAMS: Item 6 is authority to
19 proceed with the shareholder resolution relating
20 to Archer-Daniels Midland Corporation.
21 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: And a motion.
22 TREASURER NELSON: Second.
23 GOVERNOR CHILES: There's a motion and a
24 second.
25 Without objection, that's approved.
ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.
STATE BOARD OF ADMINISTRATION
March 28, 1996
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1 MR. WILLIAMS: Item 7, reports from the
2 Executive Director. We have investment
3 performance and fund balance for February '96.
4 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Motion.
5 TREASURER NELSON: Second.
6 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
7 Without objection, that's approved.
8 MR. WILLIAMS: Thank you.
9 (The State Board of Administration Agenda
10 was concluded.)
11 *
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ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.
DIVISION OF BOND FINANCE
March 28, 1996
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1 GOVERNOR CHILES: Division of Bond Finance.
2 MR. WATKINS: Item number 1 is approval of
3 the minutes of the March 12 meeting.
4 SECRETARY MORTHAM: So move.
5 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: And second.
6 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
7 Without objection, it's approved.
8 MR. WATKINS: Item number 2 is a resolution
9 authorizing the competitive sale of up to
10 50 million dollars for Department of
11 Transportation right-of-way acquisition
12 refunding bonds.
13 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Motion.
14 SECRETARY MORTHAM: So move.
15 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
16 Without objection, that's approved.
17 MR. WATKINS: Item number 3 is a resolution
18 authorizing the competitive sale of up to
19 12.7 million dollars if -- for Board of Regents
20 revenue bonds for a Florida A&M University
21 dormitory facility.
22 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: Move approval.
23 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Second.
24 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
25 Without objection, that's approved.
ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.
DIVISION OF BOND FINANCE
March 28, 1996
10
1 MR. WATKINS: Item number 4 is a resolution
2 selecting bond council for Department of
3 Transportation right-of-way acquisition
4 program.
5 The recommendation is based on a
6 competitive solicitation through an RFP, and an
7 objective evaluation by a selection committee.
8 And the recommendation is Greenberg, Traurig.
9 SECRETARY MORTHAM: So move.
10 COMMISSIONER CRAWFORD: Second.
11 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Second.
12 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
13 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Governor --
14 GOVERNOR CHILES: Without objection --
15 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: I have one
16 question.
17 GOVERNOR CHILES: Yes.
18 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: You have one
19 firm here, I think it's Brian T. Miller and
20 Oliver. -- or Olive. I --
21 MR. WATKINS: Yes, sir.
22 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Will they be
23 having any -- any bond transactions with DOT, or
24 any other company?
25 The reason why I ask, isn't a person by the
ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.
DIVISION OF BOND FINANCE
March 28, 1996
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1 name of John French one of their lawyers?
2 MR. WATKINS: I'm not aware of that.
3 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Okay. If he
4 is, I'm --
5 MR. WATKINS: He may well be.
6 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: I believe
7 it's his philosophy -- at least it was in the
8 Senate on Tuesday -- that he believes that the
9 State of Florida should be handling, under the
10 Attorney General, most of the -- of the legal
11 work. And that it should not go to the
12 outside.
13 So if you let me know when that law firm
14 has anything coming up, I'd -- I'll be wanting
15 to know.
16 MR. WATKINS: I'll check into that --
17 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Thank you.
18 MR. WATKINS: -- and report back to you.
19 Item number 5 is a report of award of
20 five --
21 GOVERNOR CHILES: Don't you think that you
22 ought to be handling these right-of-way
23 matters?
24 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Governor, we
25 do have some expertise in this area, and I think
ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.
DIVISION OF BOND FINANCE
March 28, 1996
12
1 that on some of these issues, I think my law
2 firms feel very strongly that the State should
3 be handling the work. The State should be
4 looking towards doing it.
5 And if we can do it more efficiently and
6 more cost effective, and as well as the -- as
7 the outside lawyers can, I think we should
8 really look towards that.
9 And from what I heard in the Cabinet --
10 what I heard on Tuesday is that many of these
11 lobbyists for tobacco think that the
12 Attorney General's Office has such tremendous
13 capabilities, that there is no reason really to
14 go outside.
15 So I think it is something which we really
16 should address, Governor.
17 MR. WATKINS: Efficiency and cost
18 effectiveness are one of our primary objectives
19 at the Division, and we'll look into that and
20 report back to you on that.
21 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Thank you
22 very much.
23 MR. WATKINS: Item number 5 is a report of
24 award of five million seventy thousand revenue
25 bond issues for Department of
ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.
DIVISION OF BOND FINANCE
March 28, 1996
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1 Management Services for our facilities
2 management program.
3 Competitive bids were received on March 7,
4 1996, and the bond issue was awarded to the low
5 bidder at an interest rate of approximately
6 five-and-a-half percent.
7 GOVERNOR CHILES: A nice interest rate.
8 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Yeah.
9 GOVERNOR CHILES: Like it.
10 MR. WATKINS: Thank you, sir.
11 GOVERNOR CHILES: Is there a motion?
12 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: Second.
13 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Motion.
14 GOVERNOR CHILES: And seconded.
15 Without objection, that's approved.
16 MR. WATKINS: Very good.
17 (The Division of Bond Finance Agenda was
18 concluded.)
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ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.
STATE BOARD OF EDUCATION
March 28, 1996
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1 GOVERNOR CHILES: State Board of Education.
2 DR. BEDFORD: Good morning,
3 Governor Chiles, members of the State Board of
4 Education.
5 Take a moment and welcome back
6 Governor Chiles and Commissioner Brogan from the
7 Education Summit. I'm sure we'll be hearing
8 later about the program that was presented.
9 We're grateful to have you back.
10 First item, Readiness for College Report.
11 I know that each of you have received the copy
12 during Cabinet aides briefing. We offered to do
13 the full half hour report, they declined and
14 thought maybe you wouldn't want to hear that.
15 For the record, I would just like to read
16 into the record that the college -- the
17 Readiness for College Report is an annual report
18 to the Florida Legislature, the State Board of
19 Education, and the school districts.
20 And we're aware that it reflects those
21 graduates from our school that were first time
22 entrants into community college or the public
23 universities in Florida, and do not reflect the
24 total graduates.
25 The information that you received did
ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.
STATE BOARD OF EDUCATION
March 28, 1996
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1 express the fact that there was a slight decline
2 in each of the last three years in the
3 percentage of all students passed in all areas.
4 And I think the item that might -- we might
5 want to draw attention to is, this year that we
6 did notice an increase in the performance of
7 community college students, and their increase
8 was in the area of mathematics.
9 And I think you have all the material in
10 the report, and the report is for your
11 information.
12 GOVERNOR CHILES: Troubling is the bullet
13 that you have that students of all ethnic groups
14 showed a decline in overall performance.
15 DR. BEDFORD: That is correct. The --
16 among the ethnic groups that we maintain data
17 on, Asians and whites were better prepared than
18 American Indians, blacks, and Hispanics.
19 And in the gender, females were better
20 prepared in writing; while males were better
21 prepared in mathematics, reading, and in all
22 areas.
23 GOVERNOR CHILES: Well, we've known that
24 there's been this difference.
25 DR. BEDFORD: Right.
ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.
STATE BOARD OF EDUCATION
March 28, 1996
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1 GOVERNOR CHILES: But the troubling thing
2 is to see that their performance is --
3 DR. BEDFORD: Right.
4 GOVERNOR CHILES: -- going down, rather
5 than up because we have been seeing it inching
6 up. And we see that in the overall performance
7 here. Not quite a percentage point, but it's --
8 DR. BEDFORD: Yes, sir.
9 GOVERNOR CHILES: -- still a good trend.
10 But to see this going down, what -- do you have
11 any reason for that? I mean --
12 DR. BEDFORD: When I -- when I come before
13 you at our next Cabinet meeting and address the
14 Cabinet on the frameworks and the benchmarks and
15 where we hope to go with assessment, I think
16 that is how we're going to address all
17 students.
18 And we firmly believe all students can
19 learn, and we believe that we need to establish
20 a system in Florida based on some common
21 frameworks and benchmarks in all of the counties
22 in Florida, and then hold them accountable for
23 that.
24 And at the next meeting on April 9th, I'll
25 be spending quite a bit of time discussing that
ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.
STATE BOARD OF EDUCATION
March 28, 1996
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1 with you.
2 GOVERNOR CHILES: Very good.
3 Yes, sir.
4 TREASURER NELSON: Governor, the percent in
5 high school passing all of the subjects keeps
6 going down.
7 For the sixth year in a row, it's gone
8 down. It's my understanding that one of the
9 problems is on the low scores on the math is
10 that some of the students are taking that test
11 which has algebra, but they don't have algebra
12 in school.
13 DR. BEDFORD: Right.
14 TREASURER NELSON: Is that what is skewing
15 the test down?
16 DR. BEDFORD: I don't want to say that that
17 is the only thing that is involved. But there
18 is definitely -- and we know, and we've
19 addressed it in the Legislature this year -- we
20 know that this test, that SAT tests, rely very
21 heavily on the background of the students; and
22 we know, and we have made reports that if they
23 take algebra and geometry, they will do
24 significantly better on these exams.
25 We have asked for legislation to mandate
ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.
STATE BOARD OF EDUCATION
March 28, 1996
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1 the taking of Algebra I at the high school level
2 in hopes that it will help correct this
3 problem. And that's for all students. We're
4 looking at every student being able to do that.
5 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: We have -- we've
6 also, Commissioner, asked in legislation to
7 constrain the number of Level I courses that a
8 student can take toward graduation. Those
9 Level I courses are the old functional courses,
10 which, put enough of them together, simply don't
11 allow a student to graduate with enough skills
12 to be able to access postsecondary education
13 with the skills that they need to succeed.
14 And for years, we've been seeing large
15 numbers of students move through the system
16 collecting up in high school large numbers of
17 Level I courses, which directly -- in my
18 opinion, directly contributes to exactly what
19 you're saying. That they are seeing on those
20 entry level tests for the first time a lot of
21 that information, rather than needing
22 remediation in it. So we hope that'll make a
23 difference, too.
24 As well as Dr. Bedford mentioned, a lot of
25 the things that we'll talk about at the next
ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.
STATE BOARD OF EDUCATION
March 28, 1996
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1 Cabinet meeting.
2 DR. BEDFORD: Yeah. One other item that we
3 are working on, of course, is the critically low
4 performing schools. Some of those schools were
5 high schools, and they were identified by low
6 math scores.
7 And so we are working with those schools
8 and those districts in those areas to improve
9 those particular students also.
10 GOVERNOR CHILES: Thank you.
11 DR. BEDFORD: Thank you.
12 Item 2 and 3, with your permission, I would
13 ask to defer those until the next State Board
14 meeting on April 9th. We have a technicality
15 that we need to correct.
16 With your permission, we would defer until
17 April 9.
18 GOVERNOR CHILES: Without objection, is
19 there a motion and second, we will defer that.
20 You moved.
21 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: I move.
22 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Moved.
23 GOVERNOR CHILES: You seconded.
24 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: I seconded.
25 GOVERNOR CHILES: Yes, sir.
ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.
STATE BOARD OF EDUCATION
March 28, 1996
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1 DR. BEDFORD: Item 4, an amendment to
2 Rule 6A-1.012, purchasing policies. Our
3 recommendation is to approve as amended.
4 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: So move.
5 SECRETARY MORTHAM: Move.
6 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
7 Without objection, it's approved.
8 DR. BEDFORD: Item 5 is repeal
9 Chapter 6A-1, Sections .042, .05, .031, .066,
10 .069, .094, .0952, .09521, and .0982.
11 Recommended approval.
12 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: Move approval.
13 SECRETARY MORTHAM: Second.
14 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
15 Without objection, it's approved.
16 DR. BEDFORD: Item 6 is a correction of
17 some action that we have taken previously.
18 Based upon a recommendation of Joint
19 Administrative Procedures Commission, we are
20 coming before you to amend the requirements for
21 programs in courses which are funded through the
22 Florida Educational Finance Program, for which a
23 student may earn credit toward high school
24 graduation.
25 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: Move approval.
ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.
STATE BOARD OF EDUCATION
March 28, 1996
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1 SECRETARY MORTHAM: Second.
2 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
3 Without objection, it's approved.
4 DR. BEDFORD: Item 7, repeal of various
5 sections of Chapter 6A, dash, 3 dealing with bus
6 rules.
7 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: Move approval as
8 listed.
9 SECRETARY MORTHAM: Second.
10 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
11 Without objection, it's approved.
12 DR. BEDFORD: Item 8, amendment 6A, dash,
13 3.006, pool purchase need for purchase of
14 equipment and contractual needs, Department of
15 Management Services, Division of Purchasing,
16 authorized to negotiate contracts. Once again
17 deals with school buses.
18 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: Move approval.
19 SECRETARY MORTHAM: Second.
20 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
21 Without objection, it's approved.
22 DR. BEDFORD: Item 9, Rule 6A, dash,
23 3.0141, amendment to employment of school bus
24 drivers.
25 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: Move approval.
ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.
STATE BOARD OF EDUCATION
March 28, 1996
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1 SECRETARY MORTHAM: Second.
2 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
3 Without objection, it's approved.
4 DR. BEDFORD: Item 10, amendment to
5 Rule 6A, dash, 3.017, responsibility of --
6 responsibilities of school districts for student
7 transportation.
8 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: Move approval.
9 SECRETARY MORTHAM: Second.
10 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Second.
11 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
12 Without objection, it's approved.
13 DR. BEDFORD: Item 11 is new. It's a
14 Rule 6A, dash, 4.0233, specialization
15 requirements for certification in the area of
16 middle grades; integrated curriculum, which
17 would be grades 5 through 9.
18 We would ask you to approve this rule as
19 amended. I believe you received copies of the
20 amendment this week.
21 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: Move approval as
22 amended.
23 SECRETARY MORTHAM: Second.
24 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
25 Without objection, it's approved.
ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.
STATE BOARD OF EDUCATION
March 28, 1996
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1 SECRETARY MORTHAM: Governor --
2 GOVERNOR CHILES: Yes, ma'am.
3 SECRETARY MORTHAM: -- if I could just make
4 a comment.
5 On this particular rule, I -- I'd just like
6 to commend the Department. I think that this is
7 really going to be a step forward --
8 DR. BEDFORD: Yes.
9 SECRETARY MORTHAM: -- in middle schools,
10 and no doubt that is a difficult age to -- to
11 deal with, and I -- I just think that this new
12 rule is very, very good for education in
13 general.
14 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: Thank you,
15 Secretary.
16 It's -- we hope it's going to be symbolic
17 of much of the certification changes that we
18 hope to make when our task forces are completed
19 and we come back with those recommendations.
20 But having been a middle school
21 administrator under the old system, and then
22 under the previous system, the system that we're
23 changing now, I can tell you that it will afford
24 much greater flexibility to -- to be able to
25 schedule teachers and students more
ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.
STATE BOARD OF EDUCATION
March 28, 1996
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1 appropriately at the middle school level, and
2 I think make some dramatic changes in the way
3 we're approaching that middle school
4 curriculum. So we appreciate that.
5 Thank you, Governor.
6 GOVERNOR CHILES: Yes, sir.
7 DR. BEDFORD: Did we vote on -- I'm sorry.
8 Okay. Item 12, repeal 6A, dash, 5 section.
9 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: Move approval.
10 SECRETARY MORTHAM: Second.
11 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
12 Without objection, it's approved.
13 DR. BEDFORD: Item 13, repeal in
14 Chapter 6A, dash, 6, various sections.
15 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: Move approval.
16 SECRETARY MORTHAM: Second.
17 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
18 Without objection, it's approved.
19 DR. BEDFORD: Item 14, repeal Rule 6A,
20 dash, 10.035, general requirements for
21 vocational education instruction funding.
22 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: Move approval.
23 SECRETARY MORTHAM: Second.
24 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
25 Without objection, it's approved.
ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.
STATE BOARD OF EDUCATION
March 28, 1996
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1 DR. BEDFORD: Item 15, an amendment to
2 Rule 6A, dash, 20.039, Florida Teacher
3 Scholarship and Forgivable Loan Program.
4 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: Move approval.
5 SECRETARY MORTHAM: Second.
6 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
7 Without objection, it's approved.
8 DR. BEDFORD: Item 16, an amendment.
9 Rule 6A, dash, 20.042, Occupational Therapists
10 and Physical Therapists Scholarship Loan
11 Program.
12 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: Move approval.
13 SECRETARY MORTHAM: Second.
14 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
15 Without objection, it's approved.
16 DR. BEDFORD: Item 17, new. Rule 6A, dash,
17 20.099, Florida Federal Family Education Loan
18 Program.
19 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: Move approval.
20 SECRETARY MORTHAM: Second.
21 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
22 Without objection, it's approved.
23 DR. BEDFORD: Item 18 is a repeal of
24 Section 6 -- excuse me -- of 6A, dash, 20.
25 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: Move approval.
ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.
STATE BOARD OF EDUCATION
March 28, 1996
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1 SECRETARY MORTHAM: Second.
2 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
3 Without objection, it's approved.
4 DR. BEDFORD: Item 19, we have -- you have
5 received reports and recommendations on State
6 funding for research and public service in the
7 State University System, and reports on State
8 student financial aid.
9 It is a report for acceptance. If you have
10 questions, I have Mr. Bill Proctor in the
11 audience. Your pleasure.
12 GOVERNOR CHILES: I think you can move --
13 SECRETARY MORTHAM: Move to accept.
14 COMMISSIONER CRAWFORD: Second.
15 GOVERNOR CHILES: It's been moved and
16 seconded.
17 Without objection, it's approved.
18 DR. BEDFORD: Thank you.
19 Item 20, a request to exercise the right of
20 eminent domain, deferred from the February 27th,
21 1996, Cabinet meeting.
22 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: Move approval.
23 SECRETARY MORTHAM: Second.
24 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
25 Without objection, it's approved.
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1 DR. BEDFORD: Item 21, appointment to the
2 State Board of Community Colleges,
3 Alberta K. Wilson, a term through
4 September 30th, 1997.
5 SECRETARY MORTHAM: Move approval.
6 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: Move approval.
7 Second.
8 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
9 Without objection, it's approved.
10 (The State Board of Education Agenda was
11 concluded.)
12 *
13
14
15
16
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
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1 GOVERNOR CHILES: State Board of Career
2 Education.
3 DR. BEDFORD: Item 1, minutes of the
4 meeting on --
5 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: Move minutes.
6 DR. BEDFORD: -- on January 23rd, 1996.
7 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
8 Without objection, they're approved.
9 DR. BEDFORD: Item 2 is reports and
10 recommendation of the Florida Council on
11 Vocational Education.
12 Once again, I have Chuck Kronz in the
13 audience if you would like to have any
14 questions.
15 Otherwise we would ask you to --
16 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: I'll move approval.
17 SECRETARY MORTHAM: Second.
18 DR. BEDFORD: -- approve --
19 GOVERNOR CHILES: Approved and seconded.
20 Without objection, it's approved.
21 (The State Board of Career Education Agenda
22 was concluded.)
23 *
24
25
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1 GOVERNOR CHILES:
2 Administrative Commission.
3 DR. BEDFORD: Thank you.
4 GOVERNOR CHILES: Motion on the minutes.
5 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: So move.
6 SECRETARY MORTHAM: Move.
7 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
8 Without objection, it's approved.
9 DR. BRADLEY: Item number 2-A and B,
10 recommend the transfer of general revenue
11 appropriations in Department of Health and
12 Rehabilitative Services.
13 SECRETARY MORTHAM: So move.
14 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved.
15 COMMISSIONER CRAWFORD: Second.
16 GOVERNOR CHILES: Seconded.
17 Without objection, it's approved.
18 DR. BRADLEY: Item number 3, recommend the
19 transfer of general revenue appropriations in
20 the Department of Labor and Employment Security.
21 SECRETARY MORTHAM: Move approval.
22 COMMISSIONER CRAWFORD: Second.
23 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
24 Without objection, it's approved.
25 DR. BRADLEY: Item number 4,
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1 Administration Commission, request authorization
2 for staff to notice the proposed rule amending
3 the Monroe County Comprehensive Plan.
4 Testimony received at the February 27th
5 Administration Commission is incorporated as
6 part of the official record of this proceeding.
7 Additionally, there are several speakers to
8 be heard today. And I can introduce them in a
9 second.
10 GOVERNOR CHILES: All right.
11 DR. BRADLEY: What we have is -- we have a
12 group of citizens from Monroe County that I'd
13 like --
14 GOVERNOR CHILES: I understand some of
15 those citizens would like to catch an 11:30
16 plane. I wonder if we could put those on first.
17 DR. BRADLEY: Yes, sir.
18 GOVERNOR CHILES: And see if there's a way
19 of accommodating.
20 Do we have a time limitation here now?
21 DR. BRADLEY: We're going to give each of
22 the citizens 2 minutes, Governor.
23 (Commission Crawford exited the room.)
24 GOVERNOR CHILES: All right. Well,
25 you're -- we want to try to get those especially
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1 before us that haven't had a chance to speak
2 before. This matter's been before the Cabinet
3 before.
4 DR. BRADLEY: Yes, sir. Why don't --
5 GOVERNOR CHILES: And I certainly want to
6 try to put those on that could have a chance of
7 catching that plane if they're out of here in
8 the next 20 minutes.
9 DR. BRADLEY: Yes, sir. We have a group of
10 citizens. The -- Kim Works of the Key West
11 Chamber of Commerce is the first one who signed
12 up here.
13 If --
14 GOVERNOR CHILES: Somebody needs to try to
15 help me organize this so that --
16 DR. BRADLEY: Right. And I'll get
17 Teresa Tinker to line up the remaining people so
18 that --
19 GOVERNOR CHILES: All right.
20 DR. BRADLEY: -- they're next.
21 I'll tap them on the shoulder when their
22 2 minutes are up, Governor.
23 GOVERNOR CHILES: All right. I hope y'all
24 understand, we're trying to do this to
25 accommodate everybody and give you a chance to
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1 speak, but also see if you can catch a plane.
2 MS. WORKS: Yes, sir. Thank you for the
3 time.
4 I'm Kim Works, President of the Key West
5 Chamber of Commerce. We have sent each and
6 every one of you a resolution concerning the
7 State amendments, and we understand that some
8 changes have been made.
9 We understand that you are working with us,
10 and thank you for that. Thank you for listening
11 to us. We have a lot of -- long five years
12 ahead of us. So we appreciate the working
13 and -- and ask you to continue to work with us
14 and Key West and Monroe County.
15 GOVERNOR CHILES: Thank you.
16 DR. BRADLEY: Teresa has the next name,
17 Governor.
18 GOVERNOR CHILES: Maybe if people would
19 just kind of come forward that are going to
20 speak, and then we'll save a little time.
21 Yes, sir.
22 MR. GONZALEZ: Governor, Cabinet members,
23 Jose Gonzalez. I'm a former president of the
24 Chamber of Commerce, and also I serve on our
25 land authority in the County.
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1 I know you've heard a lot from our County.
2 And I just basically want to urge you all to --
3 in further review of our plan to take into
4 account this whole question of funding.
5 Clearly our small County of 80,000 people
6 cannot in any way begin to absorb some of the
7 mandates that are being created for us.
8 And even though we know we've been working
9 together, and there are some that feel that
10 maybe we haven't been working together as well
11 as we should, the bottom line is is that
12 whatever we ultimately do for our County, in the
13 interest of not just the residents of
14 Monroe County, but the rest of the state, that
15 we do it in a way that does not break the people
16 of Monroe County.
17 So I urge you again, in looking at
18 everything that you are contemplating with us,
19 to take into account this whole funding
20 question. It's paramount to us.
21 Thank you.
22 GOVERNOR CHILES: Thank you, sir.
23 (Commissioner Crawford entered the room.)
24 MR. FAGAN: Good morning, Governor, members
25 of the Cabinet. My name is Michael Fagan. I'm
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1 here on behalf of the Florida Keys
2 Board of Realtors. We're the Upper Keys Board
3 encompassing the area from Key Largo to Layton.
4 Thank you for giving us the opportunity to
5 speak. I will speak rather briefly on the issue
6 of the cesspools being tied into the number of
7 permits being issued.
8 Basically removing a cesspool allows
9 another one of the permits to be issued up to
10 255 annually.
11 The -- the ROGO permit application process
12 has been going very well. We think it's a
13 mistake, however, to tie the cesspool removal in
14 with new construction.
15 The cesspools are mistakes of the past.
16 New construction in line with current building
17 regulations, and sewage treatment regulations,
18 only enhance our environment. We must have
19 moderate growth in the Keys. If we don't, we
20 will stagnate and die. We are totally tourist
21 based, some growth, housing for workers is all
22 needed.
23 To force new owners to be tied into the
24 removal of cesspools we think is an onerous
25 burden on these owners. And there should be
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1 other methods for removing the cesspools.
2 We also think much more needs to be done to
3 study the nearshore water qualities. Instead of
4 100 percent of the blame for this being placed
5 on the residents, nothing going to Big Sugar --
6 (Attorney General Butterworth exited the
7 room.)
8 MR. FAGEN: -- other nutrient dumpers into
9 the bay, we think that the Cabinet, and,
10 Governor, you should take a much broader look at
11 what's happening in our wonderful islands.
12 And, in fact, we'd love to invite all of
13 you down to come visit our beautiful islands and
14 see what we're talking about.
15 So we urge you to reconsider tying cesspool
16 removal in with the issuance of new building
17 permits.
18 Thank you very much.
19 GOVERNOR CHILES: Thank you.
20 MR. ROSENBLATT: I'm Joel Rosenblatt. I'm
21 a consulting engineer from the -- Monroe County.
22 I sent a substantial letter -- I think each
23 of you folks got a copy after the last meeting
24 through Teresa Tinker, which was intended to
25 review everything that was discussed at the
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1 previous meeting. Two minutes is not enough
2 time to attack it.
3 But there was something that has come up
4 since I wrote that letter, which further
5 emphasized a point I was making.
6 Nobody has identified the sources of
7 whatever water quality problems people have
8 imagined are our problem.
9 And in that letter, I had recommended a
10 type of study that could be done to plot
11 contours of water quality across the Keys from
12 Hawk's Channel, and see where the variations are
13 occurring to identify the sources of where some
14 sort of pollutant or other must be entering.
15 What has happened since then is that,
16 in fact, such a survey was conducted. It was
17 conducted by the Florida Marine Sanctuary people
18 who retained people from the Rosenstiel School
19 at the University of Miami to conduct the
20 survey.
21 The expectation by the Marine Sanctuary
22 people in ordering that study was to take the
23 contours that were determined as evidence for
24 their budget hearings which were recently held
25 in Washington.
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1 The survey didn't give them data to justify
2 anything, and they haven't distributed it or
3 published it.
4 What it did show is that of all of the
5 identifiable foreign materials, primarily
6 nutrients, there was a uniform gradient all the
7 way from the reef across Hawk's Channel, and
8 around the surrounding islands. You couldn't
9 see an increase in the vicinity of an island,
10 which if the island had been a source, you
11 should have seen.
12 You can sit here and spend 600 million
13 dollars on sewage treatment plants. And having
14 done it, there won't be a measurable change in
15 the water quality adjacent to the islands.
16 What are we doing? The fact that a group
17 of people are screaming about trying to drive
18 people out of the Keys, which is what the real
19 agenda is. If you look at what has been
20 promoted by these same people doing these
21 things, they suddenly became concerned about
22 hurricane evacuation. That's got nothing to do
23 with the wilderness or the environment.
24 It does -- only has one thing to tie it
25 in. It's a mechanism for chasing away people.
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1 And they don't show up at hearings if they're
2 concerned about public safety for the budget for
3 the police department, or ambulances, or fire
4 trucks. It's a matter of no people.
5 If that is a political advantage, I would
6 like to suggest one thing before I complete.
7 All over the country when you drive down a road,
8 there'll be a sign that says welcome, usually
9 the Kiwanis Club or the Rotary or the Chamber of
10 Commerce.
11 If this organization intends that it be a
12 policy to stop people from going to the Keys,
13 you can get nationwide publicity by erecting a
14 big billboard in Homestead as you approach the
15 18-mile stretch that says, if you are coming to
16 live in the Keys, please make a U-turn at the
17 next story and go back where you came from, you
18 are not welcome.
19 GOVERNOR CHILES: Thank you, sir.
20 MR. SMITH: Governor Chiles, members of
21 the -- of the Board, my name is Bill Smith, and
22 I'm before you as the Executive Director of the
23 Florida Keys Contractors Association.
24 I'd like to start out by saying, I
25 certainly appreciate that for me, you have
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1 reduced this issue down to one primary issue.
2 And that is the stability of the construction
3 industry in Monroe County.
4 As I stood before you back in February, I
5 explained how we had agreed to a substantial
6 reduction of permits down to 255 units
7 annually. And we did that because we
8 acknowledge a need for reasonable growth
9 control.
10 Representing the Florida Keys Contractors
11 Association, I remain fearful though that the
12 way the rule is presently written, that we will
13 not continue to authorize the 255 permits in
14 Monroe County.
15 I'm standing before you respectfully
16 requesting that the Governor and this Cabinet
17 separate the possibility of any reduction from
18 that 255. If the State does not provide the
19 funding for the five-year plan, or if there are
20 any other impediments, we feel that you should
21 have no reason for reducing the permits to 255.
22 Thank you for this time. And please
23 consider our --
24 GOVERNOR CHILES: Thank you.
25 MR. SMITH: -- our consideration.
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1 MR. PONTIN: Governor and Cabinet members,
2 for the record, my name is Captain H.T. Pontin,
3 a 35-year resident of the Keys.
4 I very seldom use the word Captain, but
5 today I feel that it will give credence to what
6 I'm saying.
7 I've been a licensed captain in the
8 U.S. Coast Guard for over 50 years. I've been
9 involved in boats and ships from bonefish skiffs
10 to supertankers.
11 To improve the water quality in the Keys,
12 millions of dollars have been spent for studies,
13 but nothing for cure. The biggest part of the
14 problem is Florida Bay.
15 The overflight surveys printed by the
16 Miami Herald every month show polluted waters
17 from Florida Bay is being carried by the
18 currents into the Florida Keys. Last month I
19 asked before you people for a description of
20 inshore waters, and to what extent they were
21 polluted by sewage.
22 The Monroe County tax rolls show there are
23 37,126 houses, trailers, and condos in the
24 County, not the cities.
25 We are asking these people to go into debt
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1 for 240 million, or whatever the figure is
2 today, to erase a problem that you can't prove
3 it exists to any significant extent.
4 You want to mandate that the people of
5 Monroe County put in sewage treatment plants
6 costing millions of dollars with no funding.
7 My septic system was put in under the same
8 requirements as the old he coons for his
9 cook shack. Both are working just fine. Why
10 shouldn't he and everyone else in the state with
11 a septic system come up with the money for
12 treatment plants in the hot spots. I hate being
13 threatened or discriminated --
14 (Attorney General Butterworth entered the
15 room.)
16 MR. PONTIN: -- against. It's just not the
17 American way.
18 Thank you.
19 GOVERNOR CHILES: Thank you, Captain.
20 MR. HORAN: My name is David Paul Horan,
21 and I appear with numerous directors of the
22 Greater Key West Chamber of Commerce. We flew
23 up this morning in the -- some pretty foggy
24 stuff to get in here and say something to you.
25 People in Monroe County owe a tremendous
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1 amount to your cook shack, Governor. Because
2 that brought it, I think, to a real great extent
3 home on what some of the things we'd been facing
4 for years and years, Catch-22. You just can't
5 get there from here.
6 In 1979, Governor Askew and his
7 administration lobbied this Legislature up here
8 for the designation of Monroe County as an area
9 of Critical State Concern. It had previously
10 been declared unconstitutional by -- in a case
11 brought by the City of Key West and Cross Key
12 Waterways.
13 Three eighty oh five five two, sub, four
14 that was passed by the Legislature in 1979 said
15 this with regard to the Critical State Concern
16 designation. This is a direct quote that said:
17 It shall be repealed by the Commission no
18 earlier than July 1st, 1980, and no later than
19 July 1st, 1982, close quote.
20 That's the way Critical Concern for the
21 Keys was lobbied in the Legislature.
22 Now, a few years ago, our State
23 Supreme Court in a case that I brought up and
24 argued in Young versus DCA, reminded the
25 administrative form of government in this state
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1 that local government decisions are
2 presumptively valid.
3 I understand there's a bill now to repeal
4 that, and to put DCA back into the position
5 where their decisions are presumptively valid.
6 And I would suggest to you, that was tried once
7 before, and if you read Young versus Askew,
8 you're going to find out that that's not going
9 to fly.
10 Now we have HRS permitting activity that's
11 become our problem. Our best guess on central
12 sewage treatment is between 200 and
13 250 million. Florida Bay is our major problem.
14 Our central sewage treatment for the
15 Middle Keys is not our major problem. Now, if
16 we can't get State or Federal funding, we cannot
17 afford to do what DCA wants us to do.
18 If somebody denies a building permit to
19 somebody who has in good faith paid ad valorem
20 taxes on a single family lot down there, and it
21 is ultimately decided that that's a taking, then
22 compensation's going to be due. Somebody's got
23 to pay it.
24 It simply cannot be the fiscal
25 responsibility of Monroe County or the citizens
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1 of Monroe County to pay those inverse
2 condemnation claims. It has got to be the
3 responsibility of State government.
4 If it's State Critical Concern, it ought to
5 be a State responsibility. Our kids couldn't
6 pay that bill.
7 Thank you.
8 GOVERNOR CHILES: Thank you, sir.
9 MR. SCHRADER: Good morning. My name is
10 Chris Schrader. I'm a 26-year resident of
11 Monroe County. My background is in biology from
12 Marquette University. I've been involved in
13 wastewater treatment in the Keys for 25 years.
14 The original thrust of the drive for
15 central sewer in Monroe County came from the
16 materials mainly in the press stating that the
17 reef was being devastated by sewage and
18 so forth.
19 Eventually people actually got around to
20 going out and measuring what was happening on
21 the reef, and they found out that on the reef,
22 that the levels and the sediments and the -- and
23 the water column of nutrients, nitrogen and
24 phosphorus, were actually -- were actually lower
25 than some of the best reefs in the Bahamas.
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1 And once that -- and that's in this. I
2 will leave this with you. This is from the
3 Marathon Wastewater Facilities Plant.
4 Once that fell by the wayside, all of a
5 sudden, canal waters and the waters close to the
6 canals became very important in the drive for
7 central sewer. And there are a whole lot of
8 nutrient sources to the canals, and I'm not even
9 going to go into -- there's no time to go into
10 the details.
11 We have no idea what portion manmade
12 nutrients are in those canals, and we suspect
13 that it is quite a low portion.
14 Furthermore, there are means of cleaning up
15 canals mechanically with aeration, and other
16 sources -- and other technologies. And my
17 suggestion, to put it very -- very bluntly and
18 quickly, is let's spend a few million dollars to
19 clean up every canal in Monroe County. And
20 after they've had a year or two to -- to
21 remediate, let's go in and see where we might
22 still have health hazards. And then see how
23 much sewage plant and what areas have to be
24 dealt with.
25 But we could clean up all the canals in
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1 Monroe County for a pittance of what the
2 Marathon project is going to cost.
3 As a matter of fact, I have another
4 document here to Monroe County in 1991. This is
5 a staff memo espousing the values of cleaning
6 those canals up with the -- with the methods
7 I've enumerated.
8 I think -- I also sit on the Technical
9 Advisory Committee to the sanctuary, and I've
10 been on water quality committees over the
11 years. And I've heard it all come and go.
12 And I think we need to go back, as the
13 gentleman said earlier, and take a close look at
14 the real nutrient situation.
15 People say, well, we can't study it to
16 death, we've got a crisis. I've been here a
17 long time, I don't see things changing real
18 rapidly. I know the canals, some of them, are
19 in bad shape. I don't see it as a crisis. If
20 it wasn't a crisis last year, it's not a crisis
21 now.
22 Let's go back and get a better idea what's
23 going on, see if we can't clean them up. Then
24 we'll look to the areas that we have to do
25 different types of sewage treatment in. Bearing
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1 in mind that the money you take out of the
2 pockets of the people in the Keys is -- is the
3 money that's there for quality of life spending
4 down the road.
5 Thank you very much. And I will leave
6 these two documents with you.
7 This top document shows that -- in '91, the
8 County wanted -- was recommending to go to canal
9 aeration. My understanding is that other State
10 agencies didn't want to do that, and there are
11 different reasons been postulated.
12 One was possibly there'd be heavy metals in
13 the sediments, but more likely, we didn't want
14 the water quality in the canals better than
15 those outside of the canals because people might
16 think that canals were good, and they may want
17 to use more of them.
18 So at any rate, I leave this with you.
19 Thank you very much, gentlemen.
20 GOVERNOR CHILES: Thank you.
21 MR. SCHRADER: Thank you.
22 DR. BRADLEY: Governor, I'd like to
23 introduce Mr. Apgar, who will introduce some
24 folks from the County government.
25 GOVERNOR CHILES: All right, sir.
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1 MR. APGAR: Governor, members of the
2 Cabinet, I'm Bob Apgar representing
3 Monroe County.
4 I'd like to make a few comments to you
5 about the draft rule, and then introduce
6 Commissioner London, who you remember, who's
7 been our growth management liaison on the
8 Commission, and some of the other members of the
9 Commission will come up with him.
10 To start with, Governor, your
11 Executive Order that we received yesterday was
12 very much appreciated.
13 The people in the Keys I think feel that
14 this shows that you have heard their concerns
15 about State agencies stepping up and sharing the
16 burdens of the critical area program with them.
17 And your Executive Order very much shows
18 the -- your intention that the agencies do
19 that. And we are appreciative of that order,
20 and support it very strongly.
21 You all know that there has been a great
22 deal of work, great deal of discussion,
23 negotiation, that has gone into this draft
24 rule. And we also appreciate that this rule
25 shows that you have heard our concerns.
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1 We appreciate the fact that the rule leaves
2 our Rate of Growth Ordinance, which was adopted
3 by the County, the first of its kind in the
4 state, one of the few in the nation, that keeps
5 growth at 255 residential units a year, based on
6 hurricane evacuation.
7 And I want to stress to you that the
8 255 units was not a number that was pulled out
9 of the air. This number is based on the best
10 available traffic modeling, transportation
11 modeling, performed by the expert in the
12 United States, and perhaps in the world, on this
13 kind of modeling.
14 And that number is important to us for
15 legal defensibility, and for long-term stability
16 in the Keys. And you have heard from other
17 citizens who've testified about how important it
18 is to the consensus that supports growth
19 management and Monroe County.
20 Other numbers have been suggested, we know,
21 such as zero, or 88. We want to stress to you
22 that the 255 is a hurricane evacuation based
23 number, it is the only valid number. That --
24 and the only number that we feel is defensible
25 at this point.
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1 And we appreciate the fact that it is in
2 the rule. We appreciate -- we have heard your
3 staff's assurance that that 255 units is going
4 to be the Rate of Growth Ordinance units, and
5 will not include vested and exempt units which
6 very frankly, Governor, and members of the
7 Cabinet, the County cannot regulate. As a
8 matter of law, we cannot regulate those units.
9 That's why they are vested.
10 The exempt units, of course, are exempt
11 because they do not affect hurricane
12 evacuation. So we appreciate the stability that
13 that measure gives to the -- to the -- to our
14 continued application of the Rate of Growth
15 Ordinance.
16 We also appreciate very specifically
17 policy 5 and the assurance that that policy
18 gives the people of Monroe County that they will
19 not be forced to pay higher taxes, that the
20 County will be expected to bear its reasonable
21 fair share costs of the program that's required
22 to deal with the problems that we know we have,
23 and that we know need to be addressed.
24 And that the State, and hopefully the
25 Federal government, will assist us in coming up
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1 with the funding that we know is needed to
2 address those problems.
3 And I know that you, as we, have seen the
4 Department of Community Affairs' cost estimates
5 of the work program, which puts the total of
6 that work program at 244 million dollars.
7 And I know you appreciate, as well as we
8 do, that Monroe County citizens cannot afford to
9 pay that bill. We must have the assistance of
10 the State and Federal governments.
11 Governor, with the -- at the conclusion of
12 our negotiations, which were going on as late as
13 this morning with your staff -- and we very much
14 appreciate the professionalism that your staff
15 have shown, all of your staffs have shown in
16 this regard, and working with us on finding
17 compromises -- there's been give and take on
18 both sides of this rule.
19 And with that, the assurances that we have
20 from your staff with the provisions of this rule
21 that our -- that state that our Rate of Growth
22 Ordinance will be preserved, I will very
23 strongly recommend to the County Commission, if
24 you find this rule acceptable, that the County
25 not challenge this rule, that the County not
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1 seek to change the language of this rule.
2 That we take this rule; work with it with
3 your agencies; in good faith, try to solve the
4 problems of the Keys.
5 And, of course, we would intervene. We
6 know it will be challenged, the interests are
7 out there that will do that, and we will
8 intervene to protect the County's interest. But
9 I would strongly recommend to them that we not
10 seek to make changes.
11 I'd be happy to answer any questions that
12 anyone may have. And if not, I'll introduce
13 Commissioner London.
14 GOVERNOR CHILES: All right. Doesn't seem
15 to be any questions.
16 MR. APGAR: Thank you, sir.
17 Commissioner Jack London.
18 MR. LONDON: Good morning.
19 GOVERNOR CHILES: Good morning, sir.
20 MR. LONDON: I think this is getting to be
21 a road show. Maybe we could bring it down to
22 Monroe County at some point.
23 First of all, I'd like to introduce my
24 fellow commissioners. Standing beside me is --
25 Come up here, please, Wilhelmina.
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1 This is Wilhelmina Harvey, who I'll tell
2 you a little bit about later.
3 Also would Commissioner Reich and
4 Commissioner Douglas and Commissioner Freeman --
5 or Mayor Freeman, please stand up.
6 And I'd also like the members of the
7 Monroe County citizens group that came up here
8 today to please stand up and please show you --
9 show us how many of you did come up here. We're
10 very grateful.
11 GOVERNOR CHILES: We welcome y'all here
12 today. We're glad to have you.
13 MR. LONDON: And finally, I'd like to
14 acknowledge that Representative Horan, who's
15 been very helpful through this entire process,
16 is in the audience -- or was until a few moments
17 ago.
18 GOVERNOR CHILES: She works hard for you, I
19 can tell you that.
20 MR. LONDON: She certainly does, and we're
21 very grateful for that kind of representation.
22 I want to also thank the Cabinet members
23 who visited the Keys and took a firsthand look
24 at things. And I know others are planning to
25 come.
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1 I know that Secretary Mortham now knows
2 more about transient rentals than anybody in the
3 world. So --
4 Anyway, that's a little in joke that
5 perhaps she'll explain later.
6 In any event, I came here today -- or last
7 night to deliver another message altogether.
8 But I'm pleased to say that I've thrown those
9 remarks away, and would like to say that this
10 process that has brought us to this point has
11 been, at least in my view, a wonderful exercise
12 in give and take and compromise. Those onerous
13 elements that were in the rule that we felt we
14 couldn't live with have been removed.
15 And although we're not totally happy with
16 what the package consists of, we feel that we
17 can make a real effort to live with it. You
18 have our assurances that over the next
19 five years, we'll make every effort to do our
20 share, and participate in this partnership.
21 Essentially that's all I have to say.
22 I think this has been a very useful
23 process. And at this point, I think I'd like to
24 tell you a little bit about Commissioner Harvey,
25 who's going to say a few words to you.
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1 Commissioner Harvey is the senior elected
2 official in all of Florida. And for over
3 40 years, she's been an inspiration and a source
4 of wisdom for us in Monroe County.
5 And she also has a picture hanging in the
6 Governor's Hall of Fame upstairs. So she's one
7 of the honorees.
8 So at this point, I'd like to introduce to
9 you the grande dame of Monroe County, Mayor
10 Emeritus Wilhelmina Harvey.
11 MS. HARVEY: Thank you so much.
12 MR. LONDON: You're welcome.
13 MS. HARVEY: Honorable body, I'm really
14 taken to tears almost with such a lovely
15 introduction.
16 And I think what Mayor Pro Tem London was
17 trying to say, since I'm the only conch on the
18 Monroe County Commission, I'm an endangered
19 species.
20 But all of Monroe County, we -- we have the
21 greatest people there, the conchs are great, and
22 then the newcomers that have come to the island
23 have been just great, and they cooperate with
24 us.
25 And, you know, when you go to the state of
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1 Kentucky, they make you a colonel. Well,
2 instead, in -- when you come down to the
3 Florida Keys, we make you an honorary conch.
4 And in that beautifully composed conch
5 certificate, it reads: You're now one of the
6 world's friendliest peoples -- people. And
7 that's really true, because we really are
8 friends.
9 And I can remember when I was first
10 married, living in Louisiana, and in everybody's
11 home was a picture of the Pope. And also
12 Senator Huey P. Long.
13 Well, if you come down to the Florida Keys,
14 you will see etched in steel our gracious
15 Governor, Governor Chiles, and his assistant,
16 Buddy MacKay. And --
17 GOVERNOR CHILES: And the Pope.
18 MR. LONDON: And the Pope.
19 GOVERNOR CHILES: We're going to have to
20 give you some more time. You just keep on.
21 MS. HARVEY: Thank you.
22 Governor --
23 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: By the way, Governor,
24 the thing that you and the Pope have most in
25 common is that you both wear funny hats.
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1 MS. HARVEY: I meant that with due
2 reverence, too.
3 We came up here, Governor, and Cabinet
4 members, with very heavy hearts. And like Mayor
5 Pro Tem London, I had my little speech all
6 written out, and it took quite a long time to
7 write it, because I wasn't very complimentary,
8 and that's not my nature. I love peace and
9 cooperating with people.
10 And I'm so pleased with how you have
11 received this contingent, and you have
12 considered the problems of Monroe County that,
13 believe me, about 86,000 residents of the
14 fabulous Florida Keys will never be able to
15 forget the courtesy and the conditions which you
16 prevailed upon and made possible for us.
17 And we were so tired, you know. My
18 forefathers, they fought the Indians, then they
19 fought the pirates, then we fought hurricanes,
20 then we had depressions, and then we were going
21 to have to take on 244 million dollars. It
22 really broke our hearts.
23 But -- 244 million I meant to say.
24 And when we leave here, our hearts are
25 going to be greatly softened and lightened. And
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1 I've never seen an Executive Order which is
2 giving the Executive giving directions to how
3 all of the agencies are going to cooperate with
4 us.
5 And we're thrilled. We're just thrilled,
6 because I really think business is meant, and
7 that all of the agencies of the Cabinet and the
8 world's going to cooperate with the pioneers
9 living in Monroe County.
10 So Honorable Governor, and your
11 compatriots, thank you very, very much. And the
12 thanks comes from 86,000 residents of the
13 fabulous Florida Keys.
14 And so you will get to know that we have
15 culture and beautiful homes, despite the fact
16 we've had all those Indians and pirates, and
17 we'd like to give each one of you a little
18 vision through these little cards of the homes
19 throughout Florida Keys.
20 Again, thank you.
21 GOVERNOR CHILES: Thank you. Delighted
22 to --
23 DR. BRADLEY: Governor, the next folks that
24 we'd like to introduce are Richard Grosso of the
25 1000 Friends, and Earl Starnes also of
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1 1000 Friends.
2 MR. STARNES: Governor, good morning, sir.
3 GOVERNOR CHILES: Mr. Starnes, how are
4 you?
5 MR. STARNES: Members of the Cabinet. I'm
6 Earl Starnes, Professor Emeritus,
7 University of Florida, Director of the Division
8 of State Planning during the 1970s.
9 Shortly after I left the Division of State
10 Planning, the Legislature abolished it due to
11 its overwhelming popularity, and transferred it
12 over to DCA.
13 I'm also a founding Board member of
14 1000 Friends of Florida. I'm here again to
15 support the hearing officer's order which agrees
16 with virtually every position taken by
17 1000 Friends of Florida; and dozens, maybe
18 hundreds, of reports, both by Federal, State,
19 and private organizations throughout the years.
20 I understand there are differences between
21 the hearing officer's recommendations, and your
22 staff recommendations.
23 Our position with regard to the -- to
24 permits is that the moratorium on permits for
25 new development should be absolute. At least
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1 don't withdraw from the earlier position of
2 88 permits per year.
3 My rationale is simple. This provides a
4 greater incentive to move forward with the
5 carrying capacity studies and infrastructure
6 needs required to fulfill the recommended order,
7 which is designed to protect this very, very
8 unique ecosystem.
9 In time, as these studies are completed, as
10 these facilities become available, you will have
11 the opportunity to relax the restrictions and
12 finally, I hope, the State can -- may withdraw
13 its long, and often very painful interposition
14 in the business of local planning and
15 development management in the Florida Keys.
16 The Florida Keys has long been the focus of
17 the State's interest. In 1975, based upon the
18 recommendations of the Division of State
19 Planning, and the Department of Administration,
20 the Governor and Cabinet declared the
21 Florida Keys an area of Critical State Concern.
22 You've already heard that was reviewed by the
23 Legislature in 1979, and reconfirmed.
24 The Governor and Cabinet were at that
25 point -- had their hearings in the Florida Keys
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1 itself, which was a very precedential kind of
2 occasion.
3 It was an early adventure for this body to
4 deal directly with statewide land development
5 issues. By holding these meetings in the Keys,
6 it was certainly a clear signal to the people of
7 the Keys and the people of Florida just how
8 important the business of the environment in
9 this unique subtropical archipelago really was
10 then; and to the people of the state; and,
11 indeed, the nation.
12 Why were the Keys declared an area of
13 Critical State Concern? In September of 1973,
14 Governor Askew called for a specific coastal
15 zone study of the Keys. He said that he has
16 chosen this area to be a pilot project for a
17 complete coastal zone management plan which
18 would be responsive to the Federal Coastal Zone
19 Management Act of 1972. And set the framework
20 for a complete coastal zone management plan for
21 Florida.
22 The study -- that study, and public
23 interest in the Keys provided reasons for the --
24 the critical area designation in 1975.
25 At that time, I summarized the reasons in
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1 my presentation to the Administration
2 Commission. National and state resources
3 rapidly deteriorating because of an imbalance of
4 concerns for the interaction between the
5 environmental, urban, and economic systems.
6 I am sure it will please you to know that
7 I'm not going to reiterate the 53-page report we
8 prepared at that time.
9 GOVERNOR CHILES: Hmm.
10 MR. STARNES: It was -- it was time then
11 for the State to move aggressively in the
12 protection of this unique natural system. But
13 many years and many millions of dollars later,
14 we're still in the same dilemma.
15 I urge you to support the recommendations
16 from the hearing officer, and thank you very
17 much for your time.
18 GOVERNOR CHILES: Thank you, Mr. Starnes.
19 DR. BRADLEY: Mr. Grosso, he's also going
20 to take up some of the positions that
21 Casey Gluckman would have -- if she had been
22 here -- she was injured in some sort of accident
23 yesterday.
24 MR. GROSSO: Good morning, Governor Chiles,
25 members of the Cabinet, I'm Richard Grosso with
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1 1000 Friends of Florida.
2 And I've also been asked to represent the
3 interests of the Florida Wildlife Federation and
4 the National Audubon Society, as well as the
5 Wilderness Society this morning.
6 We have been there every step of the way
7 since 1991 when this growth management process
8 started in the Keys, been to most of the
9 hearings, we've negotiated with the State and
10 the County, with other interest groups in the
11 Keys.
12 I dare say, we are largely -- the folks we
13 worked with, responsible for the findings of
14 fact that you adopted on December 12th of 1995.
15 We wrote -- we've written a number of
16 letters, we wrote one as recently as this week
17 detailing word for word the things that we feel
18 need to be in the proposed rule in order for it
19 to comply with the findings, in order for it to
20 reverse the decline in the Keys, and save the
21 Florida Keys.
22 The negotiations of the last couple of days
23 did not include us. We haven't been a party to
24 them.
25 I can tell you today that -- that what's
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1 before you does not comply with the findings of
2 fact the hearing officer made, does not comply
3 with the findings of fact you adopted in
4 December of 1995. It takes the same approach
5 that was rejected in those findings.
6 It doesn't even include things that we all
7 agreed to in the negotiations that you sent us
8 to after your December meeting. It recedes from
9 decisions you made at your December meeting, it
10 continues to ignore the economic realities of
11 the real costs of development in the Keys and
12 the real costs of environmental degradation.
13 Doesn't do anything to fundamentally change
14 how we manage growth in the Keys. It takes
15 20 years of an approach under critical concern,
16 and it just perpetuates the exact same approach
17 that put us here in the first place.
18 It takes the opportunity -- maybe the last
19 one that we'll ever have, for the Growth
20 Management Act to come in and really change our
21 approach in the Keys, and it wastes that
22 opportunity.
23 That is our assessment of the rule before
24 you. We've given very specific language as to
25 how it should be fixed. We urge you to adopt
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1 that language, and those changes to the rule.
2 Thank you.
3 GOVERNOR CHILES: Thank you, sir.
4 DR. BRADLEY: Mr. Gregg Goldfarb of --
5 representing the Florida Keys Citizens Coalition
6 and the Upper Keys.
7 MR. GOLDFARB: Good morning, Governor, and
8 Cabinet members. My name is Gregg Goldfarb, and
9 I'm representing the Florida Keys Citizens
10 Coalition, and the Upper Keys Citizens
11 Association.
12 We're here today to present three modest
13 proposals to save the Florida Keys and the
14 natural resources. I will -- I will elaborate
15 on these proposals at the end of my speech.
16 The last time I was here, I displayed a
17 recent study that was done by the University of
18 Florida -- South Florida, which showed that from
19 the time you're flushing the toilet in the Keys,
20 takes about 11 hours before the pollutants from
21 the wastewater are contaminating the coral reefs
22 and the nearshore waters. These are the same
23 systems that are going to be used with future
24 growth.
25 The scientists that performed this study,
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1 Joan -- John -- John Paul, states that this
2 contamination presents a health risk to human
3 population. You might consider what this means
4 in legal terms.
5 The County's presented three arguments
6 against zero growth, which is my client's
7 position, or 88 units. These three arguments
8 have been that it will burden the tax roll, it
9 will hurt the construction industry, and that it
10 will cost 800 million dollars to the land owners
11 who are denied permits. These arguments are
12 without merit.
13 The United States Supreme Court throughout
14 this century has always held that a landowner is
15 not entitled to compensation if their land use
16 is prohibited because it presents a human health
17 risk.
18 This is the third time that we have come
19 forward on this issue to the Cabinet. The first
20 two times, we were discussing zero, 88, or
21 255 units. The last time we met, we discovered
22 that there are 800 vested units that will be
23 built. These 800 vested units will suffice the
24 tax roll issues, and also keep the construction
25 industry busy.
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1 Our modest proposals are this: First and
2 foremost, these 800 vested units must be
3 accounted for in whatever rate of growth that
4 you issue.
5 Our second one is -- concerns the funding
6 policy number 4. In that policy, you discuss
7 that the County is required to implement this
8 plan to the extent that funds are not
9 available. If no funds are available, that
10 means that the rate of growth will continue, and
11 the County will not correct the environmental
12 problems.
13 We request, as our second modest proposal,
14 that if there is no funding, that there is a
15 cessation of building until this funding is
16 found.
17 The last -- the third modest proposal that
18 we set forth comes from three eighty oh five
19 five two, which authorizes the Governor to set
20 up a Governor's Resource Committee. We believe
21 this committee is necessary to monitor all the
22 activities in the five-year workplan.
23 In your final order, it states that the
24 County has to set a 24-hour hurricane evacuation
25 clearance time. The final order also finds as a
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1 fact that as of 1990, that evacuation time
2 exceeded this 24-hour clearance. This is
3 support for a moratorium, in addition to the
4 environmental problems that we've established.
5 I appreciate the fact that all the
6 Commissioners have come down here today and have
7 applauded all the efforts. Unfortunately, the
8 question is not whether these commissioners will
9 be in power five years from now, the question is
10 whether the natural resources in Monroe County
11 will be here.
12 The natural resources of Monroe County help
13 the -- Monroe County's economy, the tourist and
14 fishing economy. Will these economies be in
15 existence five years from today? I believe that
16 the answer will be dependent upon the rate of
17 growth that you set forward in your plan.
18 Thank you.
19 GOVERNOR CHILES: Thank you, sir.
20 DR. BRADLEY: The last speaker I have
21 information on is Stephanie Gehres of DCA.
22 MS. GEHRES: Good morning, Governor,
23 members of the Cabinet, I'm Stephanie Gehres,
24 General Counsel for the Department of Community
25 Affairs.
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1 We're pleased that the Board of County
2 Commissioners could make it here today, and also
3 that the other party representatives have a
4 chance to address you.
5 In this process, as a result of the
6 Governor and the Cabinet's order back in
7 December, we've been working very closely, all
8 parties, to try to coordinate this process and
9 come up with a proposed rule that will address
10 not only the findings of the -- the recommended
11 and final orders, but also do that in a
12 practical and implementable manner.
13 What we're asking the Commission to do
14 today is approve a rule to send forward for
15 rulemaking. The draft you have before you will
16 proceed from here to a series of public hearings
17 in the Florida Keys to take public input on the
18 rule, and also there will be a period to allow
19 affected citizens to challenge the rule based on
20 satisfying standing requirements under
21 Chapter 120. It's imperative that this
22 rulemaking process go forward.
23 As we've stated on many occasions before
24 the Cabinet, the clock is ticking for the
25 Florida Keys, and we urge the Cabinet to take
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1 action today to approve a proposed rule to go to
2 the public hearing process.
3 Specifically, this proposed rule that you
4 have before you today, this is the
5 recommendation of the Administration Commission
6 staff. This document embodies hours and hours
7 of hard work by the recommend-- by the
8 Administration Commission staff. And
9 Teresa Tinker and her staff are to be commended
10 on the excellent effort that went into
11 production of this document.
12 Now, the Department of Community Affairs
13 has throughout this proceeding urged the Cabinet
14 to reduce the rate of growth in Monroe County
15 for a period of time, to allow the County a
16 chance to catch up on the wastewater quality
17 problems, to address the habitat protection
18 needs, and also to study the environmental
19 carrying capacity for the Florida Keys.
20 The Department maintains its position that
21 a reduced rate of growth, starting at 88 permits
22 per year, and working forward based on
23 achievement of the objectives in the workplan,
24 is consistent with the findings of the final
25 order, and will address the problems that have
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1 been identified in the final order.
2 However, let me state on behalf of the
3 Department that this draft that you have before
4 you that has the permit cap set at 255 and
5 requires completion of the objectives of the
6 five-year workplan each year in order to
7 maintain that 255, will not be objected to by
8 the Department or challenged by the Department
9 so long as it is directly connected to cesspit
10 removal on a one-to-one basis at least, and it
11 is directed -- directly connected to achieving
12 the objectives in the five-year work program.
13 The objectives in the five-year work
14 program are all feasible, they are directly
15 taken out of the existing comprehensive plan
16 that was approved by DCA and the Cabinet in
17 January of 1996.
18 This workplan exemplifies the provisions of
19 the existing plan, as well as previous
20 commitments by the County. And what the
21 workplan does is put -- put achievement of these
22 objectives and these commitments on a schedule.
23 The Department of Community Affairs,
24 Department of Environmental Protection, and the
25 Governor's Office of Planning and Budgeting have
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1 been aggressively pursuing funding initiatives
2 to implement the workplan, as has the
3 Monroe County legislative delegation,
4 Representative Horan, and Senator Jones.
5 The Executive Order that the Governor has
6 executed today also provides for directives to
7 these State agencies, as well as others, to make
8 sure that the State of Florida does its part in
9 securing funding for Monroe County to implement
10 these objectives.
11 I just want to point out one other thing
12 that was said by a previous speaker, and then
13 I'll be glad to entertain any questions.
14 There is a proposed bill in the Legislature
15 right now. It does not attempt to -- to put
16 extra authority in the Department or anything
17 extra --
18 (Governor Chiles exited the room.)
19 MS. GEHRES: -- that the Department can
20 impose upon Monroe County. It merely attempts
21 to streamline this very complicated
22 administrative process where you have
23 Chapter 163, Compliance Review; Chapter 380,
24 Principals for Guiding Development Review and
25 Rulemaking, to streamline this process so the
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1 next time we come before you on a plan amendment
2 for Monroe County, we won't have to have this
3 complicated, administrative procedure.
4 And the proposed bill merely attempts to
5 shift the Department's existing authority under
6 the area of Critical State Concern statute to
7 the Growth Management Act statute, just to make
8 the process a lot simpler for the local
9 government, as well as the State agencies.
10 And we're working very closely with the
11 Monroe County attorneys, as well as the
12 Monroe County legislative delegation to
13 streamline that bill before presentation to the
14 Legislature.
15 Be glad to answer any questions now, or I
16 will be here forever.
17 SECRETARY MORTHAM: Commissioner Nelson.
18 TREASURER NELSON: One of the things that
19 became apparent to me as you all so graciously
20 received me and one of General Milligan's aides
21 that we went on the trip together, was that
22 certainly there is some benefit to cleaning up
23 the pollution by the institution of a sewer
24 system in the two areas where there is a -- a
25 density of development, specifically Marathon,
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1 and also Key Largo.
2 MS. GEHRES: Yes, sir.
3 TREASURER NELSON: Would you tell me so
4 that I understand clearly, please, under this
5 existing plan --
6 MS. GEHRES: Uh-hum.
7 TREASURER NELSON: -- when would those two
8 sewer systems be developed?
9 MS. GEHRES: Well, let's talk about the
10 Marathon facility first.
11 Under this existing workplan, the -- the
12 commitment by the County to begin the study to
13 determine, you know, where the Marathon facility
14 should go and how it should operate --
15 (Governor Chiles entered the room.)
16 MS. GEHRES: -- begins in year 1. And
17 under the plan, the -- I think it's year -- let
18 me make sure I get this correct --
19 In year 4, the phase I of the Marathon
20 facility will be completed; and in year 5, the
21 Marathon facility will be completed and
22 operational.
23 TREASURER NELSON: All right. How about
24 Key Largo?
25 MS. GEHRES: Key Largo is not specifically
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1 referenced in this workplan. And the reason for
2 the distinction is that the Monroe County Board
3 of County Commissioners has already approved the
4 application for funding to get the Marathon
5 facilities going.
6 They have not yet approved the application
7 for funding to get the Key Largo plant
8 underway. And I understand that that is just
9 simply tabled at the local level, it has not
10 been dismissed.
11 The idea is that the wastewater master plan
12 will determine whether that that plan is
13 necessary; and if so, the schedule upon which it
14 would be pursued.
15 TREASURER NELSON: And when will that
16 master plan be forthcoming?
17 MS. GEHRES: That master plan -- I think it
18 will be done in year 2 of the master plan will
19 be completed. And then in year 3, the funding
20 will be secured to implement the master plan.
21 TREASURER NELSON: But it won't be until
22 year 2 that they determine --
23 (Commissioner Crawford exited the room.)
24 TREASURER NELSON: -- whether or not there
25 would be a sewer plant in Key Largo.
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1 MS. GEHRES: That is correct.
2 TREASURER NELSON: All right. Now, one
3 other thing that I have received a number of
4 conflicting numbers is over the question of how
5 many permits are vested.
6 MS. GEHRES: Uh-hum.
7 TREASURER NELSON: Commissioner Brogan and
8 I were just sharing information wondering what
9 is the actual number of vested permits in this
10 geographical area.
11 MS. GEHRES: For the entirety of
12 Monroe County.
13 TREASURER NELSON: No. You've got to
14 exclude Key West.
15 MS. GEHRES: For the --
16 TREASURER NELSON: Without --
17 MS. GEHRES: -- unincorporated --
18 TREASURER NELSON: -- the plan.
19 MS. GEHRES: I would certainly defer to the
20 County's numbers on that. But --
21 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: Let me --
22 MS. GEHRES: -- we have --
23 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: Can I interject --
24 MS. GEHRES: -- that information.
25 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: -- here for a
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1 minute.
2 When I visited Monroe County last week --
3 and by the way, the Commissioner was correct,
4 friendliest group of people you'll ever find.
5 Regardless of which side of this issue they
6 happen to fall, treated us very well.
7 The one thing that I -- that I continued,
8 and I know you all have heard me ask before, was
9 referencing the number of vested permits that
10 were available currently in all of
11 Monroe County.
12 And as Commissioner --
13 (Commissioner Crawford entered the room.)
14 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: -- Nelson mentioned,
15 of course, you have to start to carve
16 Monroe County up based on those vested permits.
17 Considering as I've been told, that Key West
18 itself still has about 1200 vested permits
19 available.
20 The -- the number that I've been given for
21 the remainder of the Keys -- and that excludes
22 the three municipalities, Key West, Key Colony,
23 and Layton, is somewhere in the area of 818.
24 When I spoke to people on -- and I hate to
25 use the terminology, both sides of the issue --
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1 but people coming at this from different
2 directions, the one thing that they all had in
3 common is they really weren't aware of, nor did
4 they consider the number of vested permits to
5 really be an issue.
6 MS. GEHRES: Uh-hum.
7 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: When I spoke with
8 some of our friends down in Marathon from the
9 construction trades and the realty business and
10 others, that there didn't seem to be a general
11 knowledge of -- and I can understand that -- how
12 many vested permits were out there, or that it
13 was -- or that if they were out there, that
14 there seemed to be a significant number of them.
15 But I've continued to dig into that issue,
16 and I have a number in front of me that is
17 818 vested permits, exclusive of the 1200 that
18 are currently available on Key West. There were
19 a small number in Key Colony and Layton,
20 literally handfuls. So exclusive of that as
21 well.
22 But the remaining number that I have is
23 818.
24 MS. GEHRES: That's very close to the
25 number I have, Commissioner, also. That is a
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1 number that combines both vested and exempt
2 permits --
3 (Attorney General Butterworth exited the
4 room.)
5 MS. GEHRES: -- and if I can explain the
6 difference in that.
7 The Rate of Growth Ordinance in the County
8 exempts certain permits that are not going to
9 adversely affect the hurricane evacuation
10 clearance times. And sent -- most -- primarily
11 those are up in the Upper Keys where they're so
12 close to the mainland, that their evacuation is
13 not going to adversely affect the evacuation for
14 the remainder of the Keys, from Key West on up.
15 That number equals approximately
16 306 units. And then the vested units in the
17 County is another 516. So the numbers are very
18 close. I come up with --
19 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: But --
20 MS. GEHRES: -- with 822.
21 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: -- the purpose of
22 continued development, we're talking about 818
23 somewhere along the chain.
24 MS. GEHRES: Yes, sir.
25 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: Okay. I also have
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1 noted that over the past several years, the
2 number of residential units beginning back in
3 1982 were actually 250; the next year, 248; the
4 next year, 243; the largest number being this
5 last year of 313 residential units that have
6 been issued.
7 I guess my question is this: And I think
8 Commissioner Nelson was headed in the same
9 direction, and I don't want to steal his
10 thunder.
11 But what the plan talks about is a total
12 number of 255 permits allowable per year over
13 that five-year period of time. And, of course,
14 that works in harmony with the five-year plan
15 that I think everyone seems to fundamentally
16 agree upon with the issue of funding which
17 continues to bob up to the surface, and well it
18 should, as we talked with all of our friends
19 down in Monroe County.
20 But I'm still concerned that if we are
21 currently issuing residential permits down
22 there, of -- which appear to be hovering around
23 255, give or take, and that is inclusive of
24 vested permits, I've got this concern that we're
25 going to say in our plan, 255 permits,
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1 residential, plus 818 that are sitting out there
2 that are already vested.
3 And if -- if my numbers are correct that
4 I've scratched out, that, in essence, if you use
5 the five-year plan, could create the potential
6 for about 418 permits total vested and new
7 issuances, over that same -- each year over that
8 same five-year period, going up to about
9 2,090 over the next five years.
10 And I'm wondering, since there doesn't seem
11 to be -- or at least I didn't feel a great
12 urgency surrounding how many vested permits were
13 out there, and whether it would have a big
14 impact or not on the 255, just for comfort sake,
15 would it not be better to include in that 255
16 that we're talking about issuing the vested
17 permits that are already out there so that we're
18 all dealing with the same number per year over
19 that five years, which is approximately 255
20 vested, and new issuances, versus saying there
21 will be 818 allowable over that five years, plus
22 an additional 255 every year for the next --
23 MS. GEHRES: Uh-hum.
24 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: -- five years.
25 MS. GEHRES: Uh-hum.
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1 And your numbers are correct. If, in fact,
2 the vested properties do come in for their
3 development permits over the next five-year
4 period, then that will be a greater number of
5 permits issued than 255 per year.
6 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: I have -- one of the
7 previous speakers mentioned that the problem was
8 due to Florida Bay, and the algae bloom.
9 What I found -- and like so many people up
10 here, I've been going to the Florida Keys for
11 20 years, regular visitor. And, yes, I believe
12 that, in part, that is correct.
13 But I also recognize, along with the algae
14 bloom and along with the problems of
15 Florida Bay, even if you excluded that problem,
16 which is certainly I think exacerbating largely
17 the problems of the Florida Keys, you still
18 cannot separate the fact that the issue of --
19 and the pressure being put on the Florida Keys
20 through things like cesspits and illegal septic
21 tanks and moored boats.
22 And I saw in my fly around and my visit
23 on -- on -- through boat, an incredible number
24 of moored boats, and everyone seems to agree
25 that the vast majority of them are illegally
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1 dumping run-off, that really there are two
2 problems affecting the Florida Keys: Those
3 created elsewhere, and those that are created
4 right there in the chain.
5 So my only concern in terms of the number
6 of permits, and it really doesn't seem as though
7 it's going to have a great impact, unless
8 somebody can correct me otherwise, that based on
9 the number that seemed to be applicable over the
10 last several years, a total of 255, inclusive of
11 the vested permits, would still -- would still
12 give us our five-year workplan.
13 But it was -- would also give the people in
14 the construction business and realtors and
15 residents of the Keys enough permits to continue
16 to move forward in their business.
17 MS. GEHRES: Your preliminary comments,
18 Commissioner, are correct. And the
19 hearing officer in adducing the competent
20 substantial evidence presented at the hearing,
21 while we did not focus on the impact of
22 Florida Bay on the water quality of the
23 nearshore water on the Florida Keys, the focus
24 of the hearing was the -- the cumulative and
25 secondary impacts of development on the water
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1 quality in the Florida Keys.
2 To include the vested units in the annual
3 permit allocation number of 255 appears to be
4 consistent with the history of the ROGO in
5 Monroe County. As you indicated, the number of
6 permits issued have been right around 250, 255
7 consistently since 1992 when the ROGO was
8 implemented, with this last year being a bit
9 higher because the competition increased in
10 Monroe County for the permits.
11 Hearing officer determined in this final
12 order holds that in order for the permit
13 allocation system to be effective, it needs to
14 have competition for permits.
15 But to include the vested units in the
16 255 cap is not inconsistent with the permitting
17 history in the Florida Keys.
18 TREASURER NELSON: And may I ask a question
19 of clarification.
20 And -- and in that regard, you are
21 considering the vested number as the 500 number,
22 not the 300, because the 300 are exempt
23 because --
24 MS. GEHRES: Yes, sir.
25 TREASURER NELSON: -- they're in northern
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1 Key Largo.
2 MS. GEHRES: Yes, sir.
3 TREASURER NELSON: Next to Card Sound
4 Bridge. So you --
5 MS. GEHRES: Right.
6 TREASURER NELSON: -- don't have an
7 evacuation problem there.
8 MS. GEHRES: Yes, sir.
9 TREASURER NELSON: So we're talking about
10 vesting --
11 And, Frank, what you're talking about is
12 adding the 500 as part of the 255 per year.
13 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: Yes, sir.
14 MS. GEHRES: I believe that the
15 Monroe County attorney wants to be heard on this
16 issue also.
17 MR. APGAR: Commissioner, Bob Apgar, if I
18 could speak to this issue briefly.
19 GOVERNOR CHILES: Yes sir.
20 MR. APGAR: First of all, to ask you to
21 remember that all new residential developments
22 in the Keys, whether they be vested or exempt or
23 permitted under ROGO, will be required to
24 install an aerobic treatment unit. The -- that
25 will greatly reduce -- that is the best
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1 treatment method we know of. That will greatly
2 reduce discharge.
3 And as soon as HRS finishes its testing of
4 on-site systems, they will begin requiring --
5 and we think that will be within a year, perhaps
6 sooner -- they will be -- again requiring an
7 even better level of treatment.
8 So it's not -- we're not talking about a
9 continuation of the problems that may have
10 occurred in the past.
11 Okay. As to the vested units, there's only
12 one significant vested project in the Keys.
13 That is Hawk's Cay, a development of regional
14 impact which by statute we simply have no
15 control over. We can't touch them.
16 They have one year left on their DRI
17 development order. They have around 400 units
18 to go. They've asked for an extension, an
19 extension of one year has been recommended. If
20 they build out, it's going to be in a matter of
21 one to two years.
22 If we are forced to count their units
23 against the units we issue under the Rate of
24 Growth Ordinance, as you can see, that will wipe
25 out the construction folks in the County for a
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1 period of a couple of years.
2 That is our concern with trying to bring
3 the vested units under the cap. We can't
4 control them. If they come in, they wipe out
5 everybody else.
6 So in fairness to the other folks who'd
7 like to build a house, and who would be able to
8 get enough points to get a ROGO permit, we ask
9 that you allow us to continue to exclude those.
10 TREASURER NELSON: Are they 400 of the 500
11 vested? Just that one development?
12 MR. APGAR: Just that one development,
13 that's correct, sir.
14 TREASURER NELSON: Is four hundred of the
15 five --
16 MR. APGAR: Right. It's a --
17 TREASURER NELSON: -- of the five hundred.
18 MR. APGAR: -- a development regional
19 impact of Hawk's Cay.
20 TREASURER NELSON: And -- and where is
21 Hawk's Cay?
22 MR. APGAR: It's just north of Marathon on
23 Duck Key.
24 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: I'm trying to get --
25 I'm trying to get a handle on this, too. So
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1 you're telling me that out of the 818 vested
2 permits that exist in the Florida Keys today,
3 and that is exclusive of Key West -- the three
4 municipalities: 1200 on Key West, and the other
5 two handful -- that out of the 818 remaining,
6 444 of those are in that 818. Which leaves --
7 MR. APGAR: Are from Hawk's Cay. And
8 please remember, you've got to disting-- the
9 number you are using I think is a pretty good
10 approximation of both the number of vested units
11 and the number of exempt.
12 If you're talking about vested alone,
13 I think it's around 512.
14 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: That -- that's where
15 I was headed. The next clump that you would
16 take out of there, or the exempt, which is
17 another three hundred and something --
18 MR. APGAR: Right. Which are in --
19 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: Which I understand --
20 MR. APGAR: -- Oaks Reef.
21 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: -- you correctly, the
22 vast majority of vested permits -- and I mean
23 all but a handful -- exist in either exempt
24 status, or are on Hawk's Cay.
25 MR. APGAR: That's correct, sir. Other
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1 than that, there are about 70 units in other
2 projects.
3 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: Strung throughout.
4 MR. APGAR: Yes, sir. That's right. In
5 about two other projects. But they are up and
6 down the Keys in different locations.
7 TREASURER NELSON: May I ask: On
8 Hawk's Cay, are they connected to a sewer
9 system, or is that going to be septic pits?
10 MR. APGAR: I'm going to have to ask for
11 help on that one. It's --
12 What's Hawk's Cay --
13 TREASURER NELSON: The four hundred and
14 four --
15 MR. HERMAN: They've got a central plant.
16 MR. APGAR: They have a central package
17 plant, Commissioner.
18 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: So we're guaranteed
19 that the 444 on Hawk's Cay would not put
20 additional pressure through -- through
21 cesspits?
22 MR. APGAR: That's correct, sir. They
23 would -- they will go on the --
24 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: What about --
25 MR. APGAR: -- package plant, which will
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1 have to be -- go to best available technology.
2 And that --
3 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: And what's the status
4 of the three hundred and change that are in the
5 exempt status?
6 MR. APGAR: The Ocean Reef units are on a
7 package plant also. They have their own central
8 treatment system. They --
9 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: Which is --
10 MR. APGAR: -- go to what they call
11 advanced secondary, which is better than
12 secondary --
13 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: Ocean Reef is --
14 MR. APGAR: Is also on a --
15 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: Would that be --
16 MR. APGAR: -- treatment system.
17 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: -- the three hundred
18 and change that are in the north Keys are
19 Ocean Reef, and they're part of the package
20 plant.
21 MR. APGAR: That's correct, sir.
22 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: So all but about 70
23 have a guaranteed status of package plant or
24 treatment system -- no?
25 MR. APGAR: I believe that's correct.
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1 MR. HERMAN: It's better than that.
2 MR. APGAR: Better than --
3 MR. HERMAN: The 52 at Captain's Cove would
4 be on the package plant.
5 MR. APGAR: Okay.
6 MR. HERMAN: The only ones that wouldn't be
7 would be Shark Key, which is 20.
8 MR. APGAR: So --
9 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: All right.
10 MR. APGAR: So all but 20 of the vested are
11 exempt units. All the 20 of the vested units
12 will be on a package plant. Out of the
13 Ocean Reef, I know that some of them are on a
14 small key called Pumpkin Key, there are 14
15 potential units. I don't know whether -- how
16 that treatment will be handled.
17 But everything else in Ocean Reef I'm
18 pretty sure is on their package plant.
19 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: All right. Bottom
20 line, out of the 818 vested permits then, you're
21 telling me that all but a handful have a
22 guaranteed status of appropriate sewage removal.
23 MR. APGAR: That's correct.
24 TREASURER NELSON: You know, I wish you'd
25 have made this clear earlier. It sure would
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1 have helped.
2 MR. APGAR: I -- we did not appreciate the
3 concern with the vested units, or we certainly
4 would have brought it up.
5 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: Yeah. I've been
6 trying to get this vested thing nailed down here
7 for weeks.
8 GOVERNOR CHILES: Do we have it now?
9 TREASURER NELSON: We're hoping.
10 (Attorney General Butterworth entered the
11 room.)
12 TREASURER NELSON: We're hoping.
13 GOVERNOR CHILES: I hope so.
14 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: It all depends on
15 what my next question is.
16 But, yes, sir, I think we do.
17 SECRETARY MORTHAM: Governor --
18 GOVERNOR CHILES: Yes, ma'am.
19 SECRETARY MORTHAM: -- I'd like to move the
20 staff recommendation. And because there seems
21 to be a little bit of a question or a confusion,
22 on page 6 next to the last lines -- last line
23 rather, I'd like to add the number of permits
24 issued for new residential development. And
25 just add the words: Under the Rate of Growth
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1 Ordinance shall not exceed a total cap of 255.
2 COMMISSIONER CRAWFORD: I second that
3 motion.
4 GOVERNOR CHILES: Everybody understand that
5 motion as amended?
6 Then moved and seconded.
7 Is there objection?
8 Without objection, the motion is passed.
9 SECRETARY MORTHAM: And, Governor, before
10 we leave this item, one of the issues that
11 I believe a lot of people on this dais has
12 received input on is the docks issue.
13 And I would like to request that we direct
14 the Department of Community Affairs to
15 coordinate and assist Monroe County to conduct
16 with these other series of public workshops,
17 address the current Comprehensive Plan and land
18 development regulations affecting the
19 development and placement of docks.
20 This would allow the Department to provide
21 technical assistance to the County in preparing
22 a plan amendment, and implementing land
23 development regulations, and would expedite
24 review of those amendments and regulations.
25 This is more of a service to Monroe County,
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1 and possibly you'd like to speak to the issue.
2 But I think that that would help all of us.
3 GOVERNOR CHILES: I think that's
4 reasonable. We'll ask them to do that.
5 Thank you, ma'am.
6 MS. GEHRES: Thank you.
7 GOVERNOR CHILES: Board of Trustees.
8 Are we through?
9 DR. BRADLEY: Did they -- did they -- did
10 you take a vote on the motion --
11 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Well, there was a
12 motion, and I'll second it, and get on with it.
13 SECRETARY MORTHAM: I think he did it.
14 DR. BRADLEY: There was?
15 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Yeah.
16 DR. BRADLEY: Okay.
17 GOVERNOR CHILES: You moved the staff
18 recommendation, it was amended, and we voted on
19 it.
20 DR. BRADLEY: Okay. Thank you, Governor.
21 Sorry.
22 GOVERNOR CHILES: Come back and see us
23 again, we'll let you know when we vote.
24 (The Administration Commission Agenda was
25 concluded.)
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1 GOVERNOR CHILES: Secretary.
2 We still have some other business to
3 transact. If you would just try to be quiet and
4 you -- as you shuffle out.
5 Thank you.
6 MS. WETHERELL: Item 1, minutes.
7 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Motion.
8 SECRETARY MORTHAM: Second.
9 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
10 Without objection, minutes are adopted.
11 MS. WETHERELL: Item 2, conveyance of Board
12 of Trustees land to the University of Florida.
13 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Motion.
14 SECRETARY MORTHAM: Second.
15 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
16 Without objection, it's approved.
17 MS. WETHERELL: Item 3, rules repeal and
18 rule amendment.
19 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Motion.
20 SECRETARY MORTHAM: Second.
21 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
22 Without objection, it's approved.
23 MS. WETHERELL: Item 4 is an option
24 agreement for Archie Carr CARL project.
25 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Motion.
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1 SECRETARY MORTHAM: Second.
2 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
3 Without objection, it's approved.
4 MS. WETHERELL: Item 5 is a purchase
5 agreement for Archie Carr CARL project.
6 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Motion.
7 GOVERNOR CHILES: That's moved and --
8 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Second.
9 GOVERNOR CHILES: -- seconded.
10 Without objection, it's approved.
11 MS. WETHERELL: Item 6, two purchase
12 agreements for the Scrub Jay CARL project,
13 designation of Brevard County as the managing
14 agency, and confirmation of the management
15 policy statement.
16 SECRETARY MORTHAM: Move approval.
17 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Second.
18 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
19 Without objection, it's approved.
20 MS. WETHERELL: Item 7, an option agreement
21 for Tate's Hell CARL project.
22 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Motion.
23 SECRETARY MORTHAM: Second.
24 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
25 Without objection, it's approved.
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1 MS. WETHERELL: Item 8, five purchase
2 agreements for the Maritime Hammock CARL
3 project, designation of Brevard County as the
4 managing agency, and confirmation of the
5 management policy statement.
6 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Motion.
7 SECRETARY MORTHAM: Second.
8 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
9 Without objection, it's approved.
10 MS. WETHERELL: Item 9, an option agreement
11 for the Save Our Everglades CARL project, and a
12 request for a -- a waiver of survey.
13 SECRETARY MORTHAM: Move approval.
14 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Second.
15 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
16 Without objection, it's approved.
17 MS. WETHERELL: Item 10, an option
18 agreement for Cayo Costa CARL project, and a
19 waiver of survey.
20 SECRETARY MORTHAM: Move approval.
21 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: Second.
22 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
23 Without objection, it's approved.
24 MS. WETHERELL: Item 11, a purchase
25 agreement for FSU.
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1 SECRETARY MORTHAM: Move it.
2 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Second.
3 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
4 Without objection, it's approved.
5 MS. WETHERELL: Item 12 is a delegation of
6 authority and a waiver of survey under certain
7 criteria.
8 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Motion.
9 SECRETARY MORTHAM: Second.
10 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
11 Without objection, it's approved.
12 MS. WETHERELL: Item 13, a purchase
13 agreement of abandoned railroad right-of-way and
14 release of funds.
15 SECRETARY MORTHAM: Move approval.
16 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: Second.
17 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded.
18 Without objection, it's approved.
19 MS. WETHERELL: Item 14 is the final
20 order. This is one that was -- this issue has
21 been heard by you in April of '95. You approved
22 this lease agreement, it was contested. The
23 hearing officer has ruled in favor of your
24 decision, and --
25 (Secretary Mortham exited the room.)
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1 MS. WETHERELL: -- so it's back before you
2 today for adoption of the final order of the
3 hearing officer. There are four people who wish
4 to speak.
5 There are three who wish to speak in
6 opposition to it, and one in support of.
7 Governor, would you recommend a time frame,
8 or do you want to hold it to, like,
9 10 minutes --
10 GOVERNOR CHILES: Let's --
11 MS. WETHERELL: -- per side --
12 GOVERNOR CHILES: -- let's hold them to
13 5 minutes each.
14 MS. WETHERELL: Five minutes each per
15 person.
16 GOVERNOR CHILES: Yes.
17 MS. WETHERELL: Okay. I'll call on the
18 first person, Colonel Bernard Campbell.
19 MR. CAMPBELL: Thank you, Ms. Wetherell.
20 Governor Chiles, Madam Secretary, gentlemen
21 of the Cabinet. I'm Bernard Campbell, Park
22 Chairman, Withlacoochee Area Residents, an
23 organization of some 250 families. And they
24 asked me to represent their views to you.
25 It is true, we had a hearing and the
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1 hearing officer checked only on deeds. And
2 there were other issues which we were advised
3 would be heard later if we wanted to, such
4 things as pollution, such things as
5 comprehensive plans, such things as public
6 safety. And I'd like to expr-- get to a couple
7 of those today.
8 That area, recreational area, has been
9 designated as such for a long time, and the DCA
10 has it down as designated as recreation and
11 conservation.
12 Federal warnings specify that the tail race
13 of the plant envisioned would endanger swimmers,
14 boaters, people having picnics on the shore, and
15 residences downstream.
16 (Secretary Mortham entered the room.)
17 MR. CAMPBELL: There are area users in that
18 park a great deal of the warm weather, clement
19 weather; and sometimes, of course, in bad
20 weather, there's nobody, or just a few there.
21 But there are other dangers to life and
22 property involved. The tail race will eject
23 concentrated bursts of water right into a
24 popular picnic area, or within a few feet of it,
25 just above it, and people would be in danger of
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1 being swept off and drowned.
2 Silting and pollution of the Outstanding
3 Florida Waterway is certain. Any time you dig
4 around water, you're going to get silting.
5 Wildlife will be disturbed. We have nesting
6 birds there. People do go there to bird watch.
7 And the -- clearly not stay there with heavy
8 equipment operating around. The cormorants, the
9 anhingas, the egrets, the cranes, and the
10 blue herons will all just simply fly away. They
11 won't nest there, set their eggs.
12 The discharge is very close to the most
13 popular swimming area on the lower
14 Withlacoochee River, and the danger of drowning
15 swimmers is part of Federal warnings about
16 hydroelectric plants.
17 In addition, Southwest Florida Water
18 Management District reports that the envisioned
19 5 to 8 foot tail race will flood downstream
20 housing, risking life and property at high
21 tides.
22 SWFWMD letter dated April 21st, 1994,
23 signed by Mark Lapp, and I have furnished a copy
24 of it to your aides.
25 Flood prone structures will certainly lose
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1 marketability and tax value. Along the river in
2 Inglis, as checked against the tax rolls, there
3 are 39 million dollars in taxable property.
4 There's an equal amount in Yankeetown; and
5 across the river in Citrus County, there are
6 many expensive residences, say, 100 million just
7 as a round figure in properties along that river
8 that could be flooded.
9 But the soothing pipe dream, I'm afraid, of
10 money coming in but never materializing has been
11 sold to the state, to the county, and to the
12 municipality. And some few have awakened to the
13 impossibilities, but others have been lulled
14 into a somnolent acceptance.
15 Are the Governor and the Trustees of the
16 State of Florida prepared to risk the tax return
17 from 100 million dollars of taxable property
18 against the speculative return from an
19 economically infeasible and destructive venture
20 of an untried entrepreneur? That's a lot of
21 money.
22 What is his track record? What has he ever
23 built before? If so, where and when? Can't we
24 think this thing through, or we do -- or must we
25 just move on impulse?
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1 Compatibility should include economic
2 feasibility. In other words, you don't build a
3 thing just because you can build it. There
4 should be some reason for it.
5 The projector admits he can't compete
6 competitively with other suppliers, and he would
7 have to depend on Florida Power and the law to
8 buy an unprofitable product.
9 His product for a whole year, according to
10 the Federal Energy and Regulatory Commission,
11 would be about 1.17 megawatts. Florida Power
12 alone produced 8,000 megawatts in one day this
13 past spring. That shows you just by
14 comparison. If you'd like a contrast, have
15 someone do it for you.
16 Lack of viability means no taxes for state,
17 county, or municipality. There's a FERC letter,
18 Federal Energy Regulatory Commission, letter to
19 Robert Karow dated June 23rd, 1994, citing that
20 meager public productivity of 1.17 megawatts,
21 and I have furnished a copy of that to your
22 aides also.
23 The whole of Florida -- of the Hy-Power's
24 project relies on small conduit operation. And
25 the Withlacoochee River does not meet the
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1 definition of a small conduit.
2 As defined by Federal law, a conduit like
3 that must be dug for distribution to
4 agriculture, municipal, or Federal consumption.
5 That's the Federal Power Act, Part I. I think
6 probably you have access to it.
7 Further, Section 4.30(b)(26)(v) requires
8 that the water from the power generation be
9 discharged into another conduit, directly to a
10 point of agriculture, municipal, or industrial
11 consumption, and there is no such downstream
12 consumption.
13 And there's another conduit downstream that
14 must be drawing an amount of water equal or
15 greater than that used for the production of
16 electricity. And that does not exist either.
17 The Withlacoochee River was channeled for
18 an approximate mile of its 100-mile length in
19 order to preserve the riparian rights of the
20 people living along it in Inglis, Yankeetown,
21 and northwest Citrus County.
22 The entire basis of Hy-Power's presumption
23 is contrary to law and practice, therefore, and
24 it becomes evident that the entire premise must
25 be redefined, and the proposed lease definitely
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1 reconsidered.
2 In summary, if every challenged river
3 became a small conduit because of one change in
4 course, half the rivers in America would have to
5 be defined as small conduits. Even the
6 Mississippi once changed its course. Is it a
7 small conduit?
8 According to responsible management,
9 this -- the project would be -- would worsen the
10 potential for flooding and destroy tax revenue
11 property to benefit one whose tax revenue is
12 doubtful at best. That should be of interest to
13 the Comptroller and the Treasurer.
14 And possibly the flooding should be of
15 interest to the Insurance Commissioner.
16 We have noted that one person has disputed,
17 one person here in Tallahassee, the engineers of
18 SWFWMD and Federal Energy Regulatory Commission,
19 and those of the U.S. Corps of Engineers,
20 because I guess he knows better, I don't know.
21 But he has chosen to display that in
22 substantial knowledge to the newspapers and say
23 that we have scare tactics. If the Federal
24 Energy Regulatory Commission is trying to scare
25 you, and the SWFWMD is trying to scare you, and
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1 the U.S. Corps of Engineers is trying to scare
2 you, then I'm getting scared, more of them than
3 of the person up here who says it's all right
4 and don't worry a bit.
5 We maintain that this criticism rendered
6 against those people is much like a piano
7 student criticizing Paderewski. It just doesn't
8 make sense.
9 Now, you have before you, or will have,
10 acceptable -- accessible to you, the Federal
11 Energy Regulations Commission's warning on the
12 danger of a tail race, and the SWFWMD report
13 that the proposed tail race of the Hy-Power
14 facility will cause downstream flooding.
15 Yesterday I was asked to explain how that
16 could be, since we already had flooding in the
17 No Name storm on the -- March 1993 No Name storm
18 down around that area.
19 Well, first the Withlacoochee River is
20 flood controlled by restrictive culverts and
21 floodgates.
22 Second, we have several high tides each
23 year. If the floodgates are not closed or
24 partially closed, the full flow of the river
25 meets the incoming tide, and meets it like a
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1 water dam, and both of them overflow, the tide
2 and the river. Then you have flooding in both
3 Yankeetown and Inglis.
4 If the gates are lowered -- and northwest
5 Citrus.
6 If the floodgates are lowered and part --
7 or partially closed, then you can mitigate that
8 inflow of tide to some extent, because it can
9 use the Blue River to flow into. But if it's
10 left wide open, and the full flow of the river
11 less the flow of the tide, then you have the
12 flooding, you have your No Name storm of 1993.
13 Anyone with a bucket can prove that when
14 you add water to water, you get more water.
15 Whether it's salt or fresh, or mixture, doesn't
16 make any difference.
17 The -- now DEP plans to remove those flood
18 control culverts. And Hy-Power proposes to go
19 around the floodgates. All you have to do is
20 look at their plans, and it shows them.
21 So why were the gates not closed in the
22 1993 flood? Because the tidal surge occurred
23 during the dark of night, the operator was a
24 member of the local fire department and was
25 called out to rescue people by boat from their
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1 homes. Some of them were standing on tables,
2 waiting in Yankeetown.
3 Quite properly, the saving of lives took
4 precedence over the preservation of property.
5 All right. So, member of the Boards --
6 members of the Board of Trustees, engineers of a
7 Federal agency and the State agency have advised
8 you of the dangers inherent with this project.
9 We were told that we might appeal for hearing on
10 some of these additional concerns. The
11 hearing officer heard only about the deeds. And
12 these things are very important.
13 The lives and properties of Florida
14 citizens should not be treated as if they were
15 broken toys or rag dolls thrown away when
16 they're through with them.
17 Finally, the State of Florida has too much
18 to lose and too little to gain from this
19 venture. Approval by you would sew many bitter
20 seeds. And, ladies and gentlemen, bitter seeds
21 grow grievously better fruit.
22 Thank you.
23 GOVERNOR CHILES: Thank you.
24 MS. CAMPBELL: My name is Bett Campbell. I
25 am -- I've been here several times before.
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1 But I -- you have in front of you a letter
2 from the Yankeetown Woman's Club, of which I'm a
3 member, and have been asked to represent them.
4 We have 104 members. In 1988, we voted
5 unanimously to oppose this project.
6 I believe we called on you as a Senator,
7 Governor Chiles, when you were up there, to
8 please help us. We had help back then. And
9 we're asking for more help now.
10 I'm also the District V conservation
11 chairman. That covers five counties with 18
12 Woman's Clubs and 2500 members. We are --
13 I think --
14 (Treasurer Nelson exited the room.)
15 MS. CAMPBELL: -- I believe Mrs. Mortham --
16 I know she's familiar with it, and I believe she
17 is a Woman's Clubber.
18 Okay. We strongly object to this project.
19 But -- oh, besides the 104 and the letters and
20 faxes you got this week, I still have these 475
21 I brought last year who object to this project.
22 It's so vital to our community to have this
23 little park, this one little area on the river
24 where people can go swim, picnic, fish, whatever
25 they want to do. And it is the only access that
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1 those people have to the river. And I think
2 it's a shame to think about taking that away
3 from people.
4 And another -- but the big thing I want --
5 or the other thing I wanted to talk mostly about
6 today, the taxpayers only got a chance to see
7 the lease in early March. And I went through
8 it, I was trained to write charters on boats,
9 which is a very similar item, and to pick out
10 flaws in it.
11 According to the lease, we taxpayers are
12 going to pay $500,000 to have rock culverts
13 removed. Mr. Karow will help out $75,000 with
14 that. The taxpayers will be left with $425,000
15 of money spent to remove our best flood control
16 that is in place at present, and that's
17 according to Griner report. I have that if some
18 of you want to talk to me later.
19 I can also guarantee, $110,000 will not
20 keep that spillway channel repaired for
21 ten years. The taxpayers will be left to pick
22 up the -- the overflow there.
23 And another thing, and, Mr. Nelson, I --
24 oh, he isn't here.
25 Okay. I don't know whether he got a chance
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1 to see this or not. But the lease is written
2 that Mr. Karow, or Hy-Power, will have to have
3 5 million dollars worth of insurance to be in
4 place 90 days after he starts the project.
5 What good is insurance -- what are they
6 going to do with that 90 days? If something
7 happens, who's going to pay for that, the
8 taxpayer? There's nothing in that lease that
9 takes care of who will pay for that part.
10 Back -- I don't remember when we finished
11 and got it approved. I believe it was about
12 1993 -- but all the towns had to work on a
13 comprehensive plan. We spent tax money; we
14 spent state money; and many, many, many
15 volunteer hours, getting our
16 comprehensive plan.
17 And that area was held back at that time
18 for recreation and conservation. We're going to
19 give it away, there's no recreation. So it is
20 in violation of our comprehensive plan.
21 A couple of years ago, some senators got a
22 new statute through the Senate that
23 hydroelectric --
24 (Treasurer Nelson entered the room.)
25 MS. CAMPBELL: -- generation of
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1 hydroelectric power is compatible with the
2 Greenway. And -- that's what we heard when we
3 came up here, well, it is compatible with the
4 Greenway.
5 But the latter part of that statute says:
6 Provided that such hydroelectric power complies
7 with all requisite, state, and federal,
8 environmental, and water management standards.
9 This one does not.
10 I have a letter written from SWFWMD, and
11 signed by Mark Lapp, Assistant General Counsel
12 for SWFWMD, written to the Secretary of the
13 Federal Energy Commission, saying: Memorandum
14 to the file of Robert Karow of Hy-Power --
15 Excuse me.
16 -- regarding the meeting called by Senator
17 Charles Wheat is not an accurate reflection of
18 all that was discussed at that meeting.
19 At that time, the Department of
20 Environmental Protection placed certain
21 requirements on Hy-Power that would have to be
22 met prior to gaining the State support for this
23 project.
24 These requirements were: The entire bypass
25 channel and spillway must be included as part of
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1 the project. Hy-Power would be responsible to
2 repair and maintain the entire length of the
3 bypass spillway.
4 He is saying something, like, 150 or
5 200 feet.
6 Hy-Power must relinquish in writing all
7 control over water resource.
8 I think he's done that.
9 Hy-Power must post a performance bond equal
10 in value to the estimated cost of the project.
11 And Hy-Power needs to address these
12 concerns.
13 He hasn't. So he has not met the State
14 water management regulations.
15 Bernie mentioned the 5 foot tail race, so I
16 won't go into that to save time. But we are all
17 afraid of what will happen then.
18 As a matter of fact, we live about
19 1200 feet down river from the spillway. We
20 have -- and we didn't do it, it was dug in the
21 1950s -- we have a boat basin, a little place
22 off the river on our property, that we happened
23 to find a vacant lot with that there, and we
24 bought it.
25 But we have two sea walls, one is down
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1 lower so that when we bring the boat into the
2 boat basin, we can step off the boat on that
3 lower sea wall.
4 Then we have another one higher. And when
5 water started coming over our upper sea wall
6 about a year ago, after the Greenway people
7 started closing the locks and things, we asked
8 them to cut it off, because we learned that
9 people in Yankeetown were about to get water in
10 their houses. Another inch, and water would
11 have been in their houses.
12 Another --
13 Okay.
14 Another thing that I want to bring up is
15 that Federal Energy Commission has told
16 Mr. Karow for long -- all through the thing that
17 he can only make 1.17 megawatts of electricity.
18 Florida Power is obligated to buy his
19 electricity. But they don't have to pay him any
20 more for it than it costs them, Florida Power,
21 to produce their own electricity. And that cost
22 is under 3 cents per kilowatt.
23 So maybe you have a computer that you can
24 figure that out faster than I can, how much he
25 will lose, because he won't make any money, it
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1 will be a losing proposition.
2 Thank you very much.
3 GOVERNOR CHILES: Thank you, ma'am.
4 MS. BERGER: Hi. I'm Sarah, Betty,
5 Berger.
6 Three of you folks signed -- signed the
7 deed with the resolution with the seal of
8 Florida that you would abide by the resolution
9 to maintain that area 900 feet wide for
10 recreation and park and conservation.
11 And I feel that you have broken your
12 promise to Washington perhaps because you forgot
13 that you signed it. I -- because I know that
14 you're all honorable people. And it wasn't --
15 you maybe didn't just think about it.
16 But this happened less than two years after
17 you -- you made the resolution and signed the
18 deeds and you gave letters to the United States
19 Congress what you would do.
20 And I've -- I've typed it out because --
21 and given it to your aides what you promised.
22 And you promised to do this, and it could not be
23 changed.
24 Well, this is -- this is the gem of the
25 nature coast. This is what we're talking
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1 about. We are given -- the people of Florida
2 are given 875 feet from the top of this park to
3 the middle of the barge canal.
4 And, in fact, number 2,000, dash, 2. This
5 plant -- this extent -- this includes the
6 spillway channel. This plant will be on the
7 south side within that 2000-2. It will go into
8 part of our -- of the 2000-2 when it uses --
9 when it discharges into the channel.
10 This is the only access that -- that Inglis
11 and citizens that come to visit have to the
12 river, and to the barge canal.
13 They -- DEP plans to shut this off right
14 here, because they're going to fence that in.
15 We will have -- we will lose several hundred
16 acres of all of this land back there that will
17 be fenced from the public. And I know that
18 you're interested in the public trust that was
19 assigned to you.
20 I have letters from Bob Graham,
21 Connie Mack, and Karen Thurman. They are -- are
22 dealing with FERC about not giving them a permit
23 for this. They are hopefully going to -- to
24 contact you folks.
25 But wouldn't that be embarrassing if you --
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1 when you realize that you promised them this.
2 And what you gave them in the contract, you're
3 taking away in the fine print. Don't do that.
4 Don't forget what -- what you promised us.
5 All of these letters are all from -- with
6 Bob Graham, Connie Mack, and Karen Thurman.
7 This is part of them.
8 And National Marine Fisheries has written
9 me, and they said habitat -- now, this is part
10 of your trust -- habitat of living -- of -- on
11 the affected uplands will be affected, and they
12 said the -- the fishery of Lake Rousseau will be
13 affected.
14 I've sent this to Fresh Water Fish & Game.
15 And -- but I've just done this recently.
16 I have a study from Fresh Water Fish & Game
17 that says this fishery is valued at 4 million
18 dollars. This is all going to be diverted
19 through this bypass channel through a turbine
20 and ground up. The --
21 These are all public documents from
22 Washington. These are Assessments of Fish
23 Entrainment at Hydropower Projects. And Impacts
24 of Hydroelectric Plant Tail Races on Fish
25 Passage.
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1 And they are saying in here that when they
2 have a concrete structure, and the fish try to
3 swim upstream, the plant comes on the line, it
4 bangs them into the concrete, they die of their
5 injuries.
6 So with coming downstream, they're getting
7 ground up; going upstream, they haven't got a
8 prayer.
9 These are all -- all public documents that
10 Hy-Power has had access to, but they did not use
11 them in their application. I've gotten them out
12 of -- out of Washington.
13 This is all on dam safety. These are
14 published by FERC.
15 Here's an underwater tape that shows that
16 these structures are ready to collapse. The --
17 this plant plans to go through the -- a ring
18 wall that is very shaky.
19 Griner, that canal authority hired -- hired
20 Dive-Tech to take this. No -- no official in --
21 in authority wants to see this because they
22 don't want to change the -- their ideas on
23 the -- on their -- they want to -- they don't
24 want to have to know what's really going on is
25 all I can say. But I haven't asked you folks to
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1 listen to this.
2 But I did ask Kirkpatrick, and he didn't.
3 I asked the -- some of the commissioners, and
4 they didn't. But Inglis, Yankeetown, and
5 Citrus County are all intervenors with FERC
6 against this. That's a lot of people.
7 Now, politics last year in -- in Inglis let
8 them put out a resolution. Politics are
9 changing next month. That resolution may very
10 well end up that they won't -- that the new
11 Commission won't be recommending that you could
12 lease out this land, because it's a state law,
13 you can't if they say-so.
14 And there was no taxes involved here.
15 There's a State law says they don't -- renewable
16 energy source doesn't pay ad valorem taxes. All
17 it needs is updating.
18 They tried it last year, and it had so many
19 bills, it didn't get out of Committee. I bet it
20 gets out this year.
21 Thank you.
22 GOVERNOR CHILES: Thank you.
23 MS. BERGER: If I could just say that this
24 is where they -- the deeds say that we should
25 walk from, up here, we should walk across here.
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1 Instead of being able to cross here
2 30 feet, because the hydroplant wants there, we
3 should walk a mile-and-a-quarter, or 3 miles
4 from 19 in order to get to this area. And it's
5 only 450 feet wide, the land.
6 That doesn't give us the 500 feet that we
7 have to be away from that tail race. There's no
8 way that we could survive with that plant
9 there. And maybe the pictures won't either.
10 Thank you again.
11 GOVERNOR CHILES: Thank you, ma'am.
12 MR. THOMPSON: Good afternoon,
13 Governor Chiles, members of the Trustees, my
14 name is Dan Thompson with the law firm of
15 Berger & Davis, represent Southern Hy-Power.
16 Also with me is Bob Karow, who's the
17 president of Southern Hy-Power.
18 I'd just like to make very -- three very
19 brief points. First of all, State law has
20 expressly authorized the -- excuse me -- has
21 expressly authorized the use of hydroelectric
22 power on Greenway property in this area.
23 Secondly, you voted last April to -- to
24 grant -- grant a sublease to -- to
25 Southern Hy-Power to do that authorized
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1 purpose.
2 And, third, that that -- that decision was
3 challenged, and the hearing officer found that
4 your original decision was correct as a matter
5 of fact and as a matter of law.
6 Now, there are a number of allegations that
7 have been raised that we are prepared to
8 address. But rather than to do that, I would
9 rather be available to answer questions or have
10 Mr. Karow answer questions.
11 I believe there's also staff from the
12 office of Greenways here as well.
13 But rather than to detail -- I know the
14 hour is late -- to detail all the specific
15 issues that have been -- that have been raised,
16 I'd prefer to answer questions, if there are
17 any.
18 GOVERNOR CHILES: Are there questions?
19 Yes, sir.
20 TREASURER NELSON: Could the Secretary
21 address the question of the access to the -- to
22 the picnic area?
23 MR. THOMPSON: I could --
24 MR. PLANTE: For the record, I'm
25 Ken Plante, General Counsel for DEP.
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1 The picnic area will continue to be
2 accessible by everybody. What Ms. Campbell and
3 Ms. Berger are talking about are the south part,
4 which is across the spillway.
5 And currently it's accessible, you have to
6 cross the spillway itself, the structure to get
7 at it. It's chained off so there's no vehicular
8 traffic across it. Pedestrian traffic does go
9 across it.
10 The -- the applicant has not requested that
11 all of this be chained off. That's been done at
12 the request of the Greenways people because
13 there's a safety factor involved that the kids
14 go over there, and they're diving off into the
15 rapids. So by cutting it off, we think it's a
16 safety hazard.
17 The hearing officer specifically found that
18 the accessibility to the southern portion was
19 not an issue, was separate and apart from the
20 lease itself. And it did not preclude either a
21 pedestrian bridge or some other access being
22 constructed at a later date.
23 But our concern as part of the Department
24 was the kids that are diving off of that that
25 may be injured in the -- the rapids that are
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1 right below the spillway.
2 GOVERNOR CHILES: All right. Any other
3 questions?
4 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Governor, if I may
5 make a quick comment. I, as you know, opposed
6 this initially, and I still do oppose it as a
7 project.
8 But because of the narrow aspects of the
9 hearing officer's review, I would move that we
10 accept the hearing officer's findings.
11 COMMISSIONER CRAWFORD: Second.
12 GOVERNOR CHILES: Moved and seconded the
13 hearing officer's report -- or the staff
14 recommendation on the hearing officer's report.
15 Is there discussion?
16 So many as favor, signify by saying aye.
17 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Aye.
18 COMMISSIONER CRAWFORD: Aye.
19 TREASURER NELSON: Aye.
20 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Aye.
21 GOVERNOR CHILES: Opposed, no.
22 Let's see. Did you --
23 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Oh, I voted on it.
24 GOVERNOR CHILES: So -- all right. I just
25 wanted to --
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1 All right. By your vote, you've approved
2 the hearing -- the recommendation.
3 MS. WETHERELL: Thank you.
4 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Governor, I
5 just have one quick -- I think if I can just
6 bring it up, and I wish to commend
7 Secretary Mortham forming a resolution on
8 cruise ships today. I think it's -- it's very
9 much needed.
10 We have the opportunity to bounce off of
11 this resolution. And since we are Trustees for
12 the State's land, sitting as the Board of
13 Trustees, we can add a -- a clause to our lease
14 when we do lease state sovereignty lands for --
15 for docking, that we can -- we can put in there
16 that someone who gets a lease from us could not
17 lease any space to a cruise ship to nowhere.
18 And if the -- and if the Board wants, we
19 can work together with the Secretary and -- and
20 staff in order to draft that and have it
21 available for the next meeting.
22 SECRETARY MORTHAM: That's fine.
23 GOVERNOR CHILES: We can look at that.
24 All right.
25 MS. CAMPBELL: May I ask one question?
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1 GOVERNOR CHILES: Yes, ma'am.
2 MS. CAMPBELL: We -- in our request for
3 administrative hearing, we had several parts
4 that we wanted him to be heard on. On the
5 environment, on the safety, on some other
6 things.
7 And when Mr. Sartin went down there, he
8 said that day he was only going to hear on the
9 deed. But we could hear the -- the others could
10 be heard at later dates.
11 This thing that you just did says petitions
12 instead of the petition. Does that mean that
13 that canceled out, we can't be heard on the
14 other things that the administrative
15 hearing officer had told us we could hear on?
16 GOVERNOR CHILES: I'd like to hear from
17 staff on that, because I know nothing about that
18 kind of a -- you know, the agreement. So let's
19 hear what staff has to say about it.
20 MR. PLANTE: As part of the lease
21 conditions, the -- Hy-Power has to comply with
22 all State and Federal regulations, which means
23 they are going to have to apply for all the
24 permits to do this.
25 So all of the environmental concerns, all
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1 of the Federal concerns will be addressed, the
2 500 feet from the trail -- the spillway and all,
3 that will be addressed in the actual Federal
4 permit.
5 The flooding conditions will be addressed
6 in the permit that has to be obtained from the
7 Water Management District. Those environmental
8 concerns, and I reread the recommended order
9 this morning, and that is what I believe the
10 hearing officer was referring to is a separate
11 time and place for these, but it wasn't with the
12 Board of Trustees' lease, because it was
13 conditioned upon it.
14 COMMISSIONER BROGAN: Governor --
15 GOVERNOR CHILES: I think that appears to
16 be the answer, that there will be an opportunity
17 as a Federal permit, there will be an
18 opportunity for the Water Management Board.
19 So there are other permits that have to be
20 approved. And at each of those, public comment
21 will be available.
22 MS. CAMPBELL: Will we be notified of those
23 so that we can --
24 MR. PLANTE: You should be.
25 MS. CAMPBELL: I know we should be, but I
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1 said will we?
2 GOVERNOR CHILES: We can notify you, or we
3 can ask the Water Management District to notify
4 you.
5 MS. CAMPBELL: That's what I mean.
6 GOVERNOR CHILES: But realize, the Federal
7 government, they do their own thing, and we
8 can't exactly tell them. So --
9 MS. CAMPBELL: I know. But they notify us
10 of everything. That's how we got the lease --
11 GOVERNOR CHILES: Right.
12 MS. CAMPBELL: -- was from the Federal
13 government.
14 GOVERNOR CHILES: Yes, ma'am.
15 MR. CAMPBELL: May I ask one more
16 question?
17 GOVERNOR CHILES: Yes, sir.
18 MR. CAMPBELL: I asked it before: Are the
19 Governor and the Board of Trustees prepared to
20 risk the tax return from the 100 million dollars
21 of taxable property --
22 GOVERNOR CHILES: We just took that vote.
23 MR. CAMPBELL: You just took that vote.
24 GOVERNOR CHILES: Yes, sir.
25 MR. CAMPBELL: Well, so you are prepared to
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1 take that risk.
2 GOVERNOR CHILES: We just took that vote.
3 Yes, sir.
4 (The Board of Trustees of the Internal
5 Improvement Trust Fund Agenda was concluded.)
6 *
7 (The meeting was concluded at 12:34 p.m.)
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1 CERTIFICATE OF REPORTER
2
3
4 STATE OF FLORIDA:
5 COUNTY OF LEON:
6 I, LAURIE L. GILBERT, do hereby certify that
7 the foregoing proceedings were taken before me at the
8 time and place therein designated; that my shorthand
9 notes were thereafter translated; and the foregoing
10 pages numbered 1 through 129 are a true and correct
11 record of the aforesaid proceedings.
12 I FURTHER CERTIFY that I am not a relative,
13 employee, attorney or counsel of any of the parties,
14 nor relative or employee of such attorney or counsel,
15 or financially interested in the foregoing action.
16 DATED THIS 5TH day of APRIL, 1996.
17
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19 LAURIE L. GILBERT, RPR, CCR
100 Salem Court
20 Tallahassee, Florida 32301
(904) 878-2221
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