T H E C A B I N E T
S T A T E O F F L O R I D A
Representing:
YEAR 2000 CABINET SCHEDULE
STATE BOARD OF EDUCATION
BOARD OF TRUSTEES OF THE
INTERNAL IMPROVEMENT TRUST FUND
SOUTH FLORIDA WATER MANAGEMENT DISTRICT
FINANCIAL MANAGEMENT INFORMATION BOARD
ADMINISTRATION COMMISSION
FLORIDA LAND AND WATER ADJUDICATORY COMMISSION
FLORIDA DEPARTMENT OF LAW ENFORCEMENT
DEPARTMENT OF HIGHWAY SAFETY AND MOTOR VEHICLES
DEPARTMENT OF REVENUE
VOLUME I
The above agencies came to be heard before
THE FLORIDA CABINET, Honorable Governor Bush
presiding, in the Cabinet Meeting Room, LL-03,
The Capitol, Tallahassee, Florida, on Tuesday,
September 28, 1999, commencing at approximately
9:15 a.m.
Reported by:
LAURIE L. GILBERT
Registered Professional Reporter
Certified Court Reporter
Certified Realtime Reporter
Registered Merit Reporter
Notary Public in and for
the State of Florida at Large
ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.
100 SALEM COURT
TALLAHASSEE, FLORIDA 32301
850/878-2221
2
APPEARANCES:
Representing the Florida Cabinet:
JEB BUSH
Governor
BOB MILLIGAN
Comptroller
KATHERINE HARRIS
Secretary of State
BOB BUTTERWORTH
Attorney General
BILL NELSON
Treasurer
TOM GALLAGHER
Commissioner of Education
*
ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.
3
September 28, 1999
I N D E X
ITEM ACTION PAGE
YEAR 2000 CABINET AGENDA:
For Information Only 4
STATE BOARD OF EDUCATION:
(Presented by Wayne V. Pierson,
Deputy Commissioner)
1 Deferred 6
2 Approved 6
3 K-12 - Approved 66
Community Colleges - Approved 78
State University System -
Approved 94
4 Approved 113
5 Approved 137
CERTIFICATE OF REPORTER 145
*
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YEAR 2000 CABINET AGENDA 4
September 28, 1999
1 P R O C E E D I N G S
2 (The agenda items commenced at 10:00 a.m.)
3 GOVERNOR BUSH: And also, Cabinet members,
4 you'll see the proposed year 2000 calendar,
5 which -- which I want to make sure that you all
6 are aware of. And I guess if there's any
7 problems with this, get back to your
8 Cabinet Aides.
9 (The Year 2000 Cabinet Agenda was
10 concluded.)
11 *
12
13
14
15
16
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
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1 GOVERNOR BUSH: State Board of Education.
2 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Let me could, if I
3 could --
4 GOVERNOR BUSH: Yeah.
5 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: -- Governor, before
6 we get to that, and it's appropriate that State
7 Board of Education --
8 GOVERNOR BUSH: Oh, I'm sorry.
9 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: -- is coming up.
10 GOVERNOR BUSH: That's right.
11 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Last Saturday, the
12 Executive Spelling Bee for Literacy, sponsored
13 by Plus, the Tallahassee Democrat, and
14 Governor's Square was held.
15 (Discussion off the record.)
16 GOVERNOR BUSH: Commissioner Gallagher, are
17 you ready for the --
18 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Yes, we are.
19 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- Board of Education?
20 MR. PIERSON: Item 1, we recommend it be
21 deferred.
22 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Move deferral.
23 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Second.
24 GOVERNOR BUSH: Moved and seconded to
25 defer.
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1 Without objection, it's approved.
2 MR. PIERSON: Item 2, Subject Matter
3 Content Standards for Florida Teachers as
4 approved by the Florida Education Standards
5 Commission.
6 We have a presentation by
7 Dr. William L. Proctor from Flagler College.
8 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Recommend approval.
9 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Second.
10 GOVERNOR BUSH: Moved and seconded.
11 Without objection, it's approved.
12 Good morning.
13 MR. BOUZIANIS: Good morning.
14 Good morning, Governor Bush,
15 Commissioner Gallagher, and members of the
16 Cabinet. My name is Stephen Bouzianis. I am a
17 Personnel Administrator in Seminole County
18 Public Schools, and also the Chairperson of the
19 Florida Education Standards Commission.
20 Also present behind me today is
21 Dr. William Proctor, who's the First Vice Chair
22 of the Commission, President of Flagler College
23 in St. Augustine, and Chairman of the Board of
24 Trustees of the Florida School for the Deaf and
25 the Blind.
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September 28, 1999
1 On behalf of the thousands of educators who
2 have participated in this project, we are proud
3 to present for your approval the Subject Matter
4 Content Standards for Florida's teachers.
5 I would first like to give you a brief
6 historical overview. In 1993, the Florida
7 Legislature directed the Florida Education
8 Standards Commission to develop and validate
9 competencies needed by teachers to implement
10 the goals of the Education Accountability Act.
11 This effort resulted in the development of
12 the 12 Florida Educator Accomplished Practices,
13 of which the eighth educator practice is
14 knowledge of subject matter.
15 The Florida Educator Accomplished Practices
16 were adopted by the State Board of Education on
17 November 7th, 1996.
18 In 1995, the Florida Legislature directed
19 the Florida Education Standards Commission to
20 develop and validate Teacher Subject Content
21 Standards which support performance
22 expectations for Florida's students, as
23 explicated in the Sunshine State Standards.
24 The Education Standards Commission
25 developed the subject content standards in the
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September 28, 1999
1 same subjects that have been identified in the
2 Sunshine State Standards, as well as the -- as
3 well as elementary education.
4 The following are the subject content
5 areas: English; mathematics; in the area of
6 science, biology, chemistry, earth/space
7 science and physics; in the area of
8 social studies, economics, geography, history,
9 political science, psychology, sociology, and
10 comprehensive social studies; art;
11 foreign languages; health; music;
12 physical education; and elementary education.
13 Now Dr. Proctor will review the recommended
14 uses for the subject content standards.
15 DR. PROCTOR: Thank you, Steve.
16 Governor Bush, members of the Cabinet, as
17 Steve told you, I am William Proctor. I'm
18 President of Flagler College. But I'm
19 currently serving as the First Vice Chairman of
20 the Florida Education Standards Commission.
21 There are many uses for the Content
22 Standards, but four are of particular
23 importance, and I'd like to review those
24 briefly with you this morning.
25 First, the standards will be an essential
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1 part of the process for State approval of
2 teacher preparation programs.
3 Second, the standards will facilitate the
4 articulation of content preparation between the
5 Colleges of Education and the Colleges of Arts
6 and Sciences, as well as the State's
7 community colleges.
8 The standards are also essential to any
9 alternative teacher education programs or any
10 mode of alternative certification.
11 Finally, the standards must be embedded in
12 the Florida teacher certification examination,
13 particularly, of course, in the subject matter
14 aspects of that examination.
15 Those are the four major uses of the
16 standards.
17 And I'd welcome any questions.
18 Otherwise, that completes my report.
19 GOVERNOR BUSH: Any questions?
20 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Let me also
21 mention that according to part of the A+ plan,
22 there is a committee that's started meeting --
23 had their first meeting yesterday, and
24 Dr. Proctor is a member of that committee.
25 It is looking into the actual curriculum in
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1 our public school system for our teacher
2 colleges. We have members of that committee
3 that are teachers, and teachers of the year.
4 We have principals, superintendents, deans of
5 colleges of education, and presidents of
6 colleges that have colleges of education --
7 universities that have colleges of education
8 there, looking over the whole curriculum that
9 exists for our teachers today, to see to it
10 that that curriculum matches the standards
11 here, and also is delivering to those students
12 what they need to be successful teachers.
13 And when I first took office, that's the
14 one thing that we heard a lot of complaints
15 about, as to the teachers don't seem to be
16 getting in school what they need to be
17 successful in the classroom, without a lot of
18 additional assistance and help.
19 And so we hope that this committee will
20 help set a curriculum that will deliver to the
21 districts and the individual school principals,
22 the teachers that they need that can carry out
23 that -- that job. And we thank you for serving
24 on that, too.
25 GOVERNOR BUSH: Thank you very much.
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1 MR. BOUZIANIS: Thank you.
2 GOVERNOR BUSH: Item Number 3.
3 MR. PIERSON: Item 3 is a presentation of
4 fiscal year 2000-2001 Legislative Budget
5 Requests.
6 K to 12 budget will be presented by
7 Commissioner Gallagher; followed by community
8 colleges, by Executive Director,
9 David Armstrong; and Chancellor Herbert with
10 the Board of Regents.
11 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Governor, members
12 of the Board, I request your approval of the
13 2000-2001 budget request for public school
14 education and related programs.
15 Governor, many of the initiatives in this
16 budget are important to the achievement of the
17 goals that you articulated so well during the
18 1999 session of the Legislature.
19 This budget has been built around five
20 priorities: One, highest student achievement;
21 two, quality educators; three, safe schools;
22 four, school readiness; and, five, technology.
23 One, our highest -- highest student
24 achievement. It's our business is to sustain
25 ways to improve the performance of each of the
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1 2.3 million students in Florida public schools.
2 Striving for highest student achievement will
3 require a commitment of the financial and
4 human resources that are requested in this
5 budget.
6 Florida schools will serve 43,815 new
7 students in school year 2000-2001. Fundamental
8 to the achievement of our goals is priority
9 funding for the Florida Education Finance
10 Program, the FEFP.
11 Let me highlight selected items from the
12 budget.
13 The FEFP recommendation provides for an
14 increase in funds per weighted student FTE of
15 4.1 percent, and a bottom line increase of
16 695 million in State and local funds.
17 Especially important are the discretionary
18 or flexible funds for Supplemental Academic
19 Instruction, or SAI, 607 million dollars total,
20 an 80 percent increase; and the district
21 discretionary lottery fund,
22 270 million dollars, a 119 million dollar
23 increase.
24 That -- those dollars are the ones that the
25 districts can use for after-school remediation
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September 28, 1999
1 and/or summer school, as they see fit, whatever
2 fits the school and the student population.
3 The funding for SAI is important to the
4 goal of each Florida student gaining one year
5 of knowledge for one year in school, because
6 the funds may be used for a wide variety of
7 educational activity, as I said, including
8 expanded summer school and after school, and
9 before school academic assistance.
10 The ability to read, even in this era of
11 technology, is essential to learning. The
12 budget requests 11 million, a total of
13 26 million, in additional funds for school use
14 for research based proven reading programs.
15 In addition to the funds requested for
16 reading, 31 million is requested for school and
17 instructional enhancement to provide extra
18 resources to reach those in need of academic
19 help, particularly the low performing schools.
20 Students who are absent from school cannot
21 learn. This budget includes 10 million dollars
22 for attendance incentive supplement to provide
23 additional funds for school districts that
24 exceed the State average attendance percentage,
25 or show gains in average attendance from one
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September 28, 1999
1 year to the next.
2 Current law would financially reward
3 districts with good attendance rates, and
4 punish those with poor rates. This supplement
5 is the positive way to deal with an important
6 issue.
7 The School Recognition Program rewards
8 schools that demonstrate sustained high
9 academic performance, and those where
10 performance improves from one year to the next.
11 Thirty million is requested for this positive
12 program, and I'll talk a little bit more about
13 that program today.
14 A 15 million dollar increase is requested
15 for the Bright Futures Scholarship Program, for
16 a total of 145 million. The program will
17 provide a financial reward to 79,000 of
18 Florida's brightest and best students.
19 But the budget also contains 132 million
20 dollars for financial aid for students with
21 demonstrated financial need.
22 Number two, we talked about quality
23 educators. The second priority in the budget
24 is quality educators. As the bar is raised for
25 student performance, so, too, is the challenge
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September 28, 1999
1 raised for our teachers in some 3500 schools.
2 This budget contains an exciting program
3 called the teacher mentor program. For the
4 initial year, 20 million dollars is requested.
5 The dollars would provide $50,000 grants to
6 400 pilot schools to develop the program to be
7 implemented with the 2000-2002 -- 2001-2002
8 school year.
9 Five levels of employment would be
10 established from paraprofessional to mentor
11 teacher, a team of people dedicated to raising
12 student performance, and receiving financial
13 incentives for doing so. Mentor teachers will
14 lead the teams and will be either national
15 Board certified, regional teachers of the year,
16 or hold equivalent status as defined by this
17 Board.
18 The mentors will coach the team and will be
19 compensated with a salary and incentives that
20 could equal twice the average salary for the
21 District. That could be up to $84,000 in a
22 district like Dade.
23 I'm excited about the potential for this
24 program.
25 Other commitments to quality educators are
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September 28, 1999
1 also provided. For example, 35 million is
2 targeted for staff training, 18 million for the
3 pursuit of national board certification --
4 certification by teachers, 15 million to
5 provide each teacher with $100 for materials
6 and supplies.
7 The third item I want to talk about is safe
8 schools and student transportation. Of the
9 56 million dollars increase requested in this
10 area, 39 million is for direct safe school
11 services.
12 Funding alone will not solve school safety
13 problem. A vigilant school and community will
14 be the keys to making the learning environment
15 for every school a safe one.
16 To provide structure to the vil-- the
17 viligance (sic), 20 million is requested for
18 safe schools intervention assistance teams for
19 additional staff, psychologists, social
20 workers, guidance counselors, and behavioral
21 specialists trained to meet the school safety
22 needs in each school improvement plan.
23 Four, school readiness. What has been
24 learned about the early childhood development
25 of the brain in young children makes my fourth
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September 28, 1999
1 priority so very important. I am requesting
2 the 41 million dollar increase in the funding
3 for our preschool programs. This will provide
4 early education to 12,000 children who might
5 otherwise be on a waiting list. Early
6 education for our children cannot wait.
7 Five, technology. My fifth and final
8 priority is for funding of technology. So many
9 exciting educational activities are possible
10 with the assistance of technology.
11 The budget that I'm asking you to approve
12 includes an increase of 59 million for
13 education technology initiatives, 129 million
14 total.
15 Funds are requested for hardware and
16 software for our schools, 86 million:
17 Eight million (sic) to fund 50 additional
18 milleneum high schools, high tech career and
19 academic training; and 6 million to continue
20 the development of the Florida on-line
21 high school.
22 This is an exciting time for Florida
23 public education, and I am pleased to recommend
24 to you the approval of the 2000-2001 budget
25 request.
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1 I'll be glad to answer any questions.
2 TREASURER NELSON: Governor, I have a
3 couple.
4 GOVERNOR BUSH: Please, Bill.
5 TREASURER NELSON: I thank you, Governor,
6 for the opportunity, as you have articulated,
7 that we, sitting as the State Board of
8 Education, would have a -- an opportunity to
9 get into some of the policy items.
10 And recognizing that this is the proposal
11 of the Department of Education, and clearly it
12 is massaged, and it is proposed to the
13 Legislature according to your particular
14 wishes. But, nevertheless, this is an
15 important process right here.
16 So if I may, Tom, I'd like to address a
17 couple of questions here.
18 First, with regard to hiring of new
19 teachers to reduce class size. It's my
20 understanding that there is a item here in your
21 budget for 50 million dollars for special
22 projects. And it was unclear to me what this
23 50 million appropriation is for, or how it will
24 be used.
25 Is it anticipated to be used with regard to
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1 the class size reduction; and if so, I notice
2 that in the present year's budget, there is
3 100 million dollar line item for class size
4 reduction.
5 So see if you can clarify some of that,
6 please.
7 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: I can.
8 The 50 million dollars we -- in following
9 last year's veto messages, we asked legislators
10 if they had items that they thought were
11 important to education in the State of Florida
12 that they would like us to consider and look at
13 in regards to their input into our budget,
14 because we believe that that -- that is a good
15 thing to do.
16 We received quite a few requests and
17 recommendations. And we -- some are in our
18 budget. We took them, and it became part of
19 our budget because they were items that we
20 happened to think -- some of them were already
21 there anyway, and so we kept them; and some we
22 put.
23 Others we felt are good -- very good ideas,
24 but needed to be prioritized by someone
25 independent. So we took those items that we
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1 thought did fit the Governor's criteria that
2 would be of a statewide significance,
3 et cetera, and established that as a -- an
4 amount of money in our budget for those
5 legislative items that they might feel were
6 important and would want to include in their
7 budget.
8 And so that's what that particular number
9 is.
10 TREASURER NELSON: Is there a concern there
11 that -- that that 50 million would be used
12 without the specificity that -- the discretion
13 of the Legislature, and that there would be no
14 requirements for how that money would be used?
15 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: No. I -- I would
16 look to the Legislature for guidance in that.
17 And we have volunteered to allow the
18 legislative priorities to go to an independent
19 board, much like they do in the Department over
20 in the Secretary of State's office in regards
21 to arts projects.
22 Those projects that an independent group
23 would look at and say, these -- these are ones
24 that we think should be -- have priority over
25 others, would -- would take that priority. And
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September 28, 1999
1 it could be a group made up of legislators, or
2 we would be willing to do it in the Department.
3 It would sort of be up -- a legislative
4 decision.
5 TREASURER NELSON: All right. Let me ask
6 you about summer school and dropout prevention.
7 It's my understanding that it's been lumped
8 together in a 600 million dollar sum called the
9 Supplemental Academic Instruction
10 appropriation.
11 Help me understand, is -- is this new
12 money. Schools traditionally have used this
13 funding for summer school and dropout
14 prevention. And it's my concern that school
15 districts might be forced to abandon those
16 programs in order to find a pot to help their
17 poor performing schools.
18 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Well --
19 TREASURER NELSON: And that this might not
20 be new funding.
21 So can you clarify that?
22 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Well, last year
23 there was 527 million dollars that went into
24 this particular funding. And it was split out
25 from the FEFP so that it would be used for
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1 after school and summer school remediation.
2 Many districts chose to use that
3 after school money for those D and F schools in
4 their district. It's totally district
5 discretionary in regards to how they use those
6 dollars to increase student learning. This
7 year we asked for an 80 million dollar increase
8 in that.
9 Last year -- prior to last year, there was
10 an increase in funding when it came to dollars
11 for dropout prevention.
12 Those students that were in dropout
13 prevention got a higher than a -- than the
14 normal FTE. That was eliminated in last year's
15 budget, and we left it that way this year.
16 That was the legislative decision, and
17 I believe they'd stick with that, so we're not
18 trying to fight them on that.
19 But we did add that 80 million dollars to
20 get it to 600 million dollars for that -- what
21 I would call the remediation fund, which,
22 of course, can be used for dropout prevention
23 if a district wants to use some of that.
24 But remember, they're already getting the
25 straight FTE that can be used.
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September 28, 1999
1 Some districts contract out for those
2 students that are at risk for dropout
3 prevention to companies that specialize in
4 that.
5 Some have special schools for those
6 students; and some, of course, work closely
7 with them and use some of the funds, and will
8 be able to use some of the funds from this
9 additional money that's being put up this year,
10 which is over 600 million dollars.
11 GOVERNOR BUSH: Commissioner, isn't it true
12 that last -- to do an apple to apple
13 comparison, this budget year has 70 million
14 dollars more of that money than the previous
15 year. And what you're proposing is
16 80 million dollars more.
17 And there was some confusion after the
18 budget was passed about --
19 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: There was.
20 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- school districts saying
21 that they couldn't use the money for certain
22 things. That's all been cleared up now,
23 I believe, and they can actually use it for
24 salary increases, so long as it relates to this
25 broad consideration of social promotion which
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September 28, 1999
1 we're moving away from, in a rather historic
2 way, where we're no longer going to allow
3 ninth graders to read at fourth grade level.
4 So we're -- we're giving the school
5 districts a lot more flexibility to develop the
6 strategies around the kids that aren't
7 learning. And they could be in the best rated
8 schools, or they could be in the schools that
9 are not graded that high.
10 And the flexibility is given to the
11 school districts to spend it as they see fit.
12 I think it's -- it's a -- new money in that
13 sense, because we put new money in in the last
14 budget.
15 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Right. I -- I
16 basically -- it's Supplemental Academic
17 Instruction is what it's officially called. I
18 refer to it as remediation money.
19 And it should be used for any -- any
20 students, no matter what school they're in, for
21 remediation that they need in order to be up to
22 grade level.
23 TREASURER NELSON: So if I understand both
24 of you, if -- if the school district decided
25 that they did not want to use it on the -- the
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September 28, 1999
1 dropout and the summer school programs, they
2 could use it elsewhere --
3 GOVERNOR BUSH: They could use it for --
4 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: After school.
5 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- after school meeting
6 programs, they --
7 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Exactly.
8 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- could use it for
9 additional teacher's aides in the -- with the
10 kids that aren't learning as -- as well.
11 The whole point is to not tell -- is to
12 eliminate the categorical funding with the --
13 What do you call it, General, the
14 stovepipe? Is that what you call that --
15 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: That's as good a way
16 as any.
17 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- the stovepipe, and to
18 put a lump sum out there, and say, our
19 expectations are these kids are going to
20 learn -- students -- I was chastised by a
21 Congressman from South Carolina using the word
22 kid. Kids are baby goats apparently.
23 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Not in Florida --
24 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- students --
25 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: -- I guess.
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September 28, 1999
1 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- students learning a
2 year's worth of knowledge as the assessments
3 and standards we've established dictate in a
4 year's time.
5 TREASURER NELSON: All right. Let me ask
6 you about the teacher shortage in Florida.
7 It's my understanding that a number of
8 states are giving some extraordinary bonuses to
9 teachers to try to get them to come to the
10 states because there --
11 (Attorney General Butterworth exited the
12 room.)
13 TREASURER NELSON: -- is this looming
14 teacher shortage. It's my understanding that
15 the state of Georgia, compared with us, ups its
16 salary higher for the starting teacher than we
17 do.
18 In your budget, it's my understanding, you
19 have 20 million in funding to attract the
20 critical number of teachers that Florida is
21 going to need in the coming year.
22 Can you address your thinking as to that
23 specific figure, and is it enough?
24 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Well, what
25 I believe -- yes, there are -- and
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September 28, 1999
1 Massachusetts, for example, gives $20,000
2 signing bonus. It's almost getting to be like
3 sports up there.
4 So they get a whole bunch of people to
5 apply. They don't tell you that you've got to
6 be in the top 10 percent of your class, you
7 have to be in one of those special categories
8 where they have a shortage, and everything
9 else. But they do get people to get in there,
10 and it's an attractive thing.
11 I don't think -- we've done well recruiting
12 up there, actually, to -- even with that
13 signing bonus they have, we went to
14 Massachusetts to recruit, to have teachers come
15 to Florida. And we will continue to assist the
16 districts in -- in recruiting methods.
17 The 20 million dollars is to set teachers
18 apart from what they have been in the past.
19 The problem that we have, in my personal
20 opinion, is that teachers, no matter how good
21 they are, get stuck in a box of --
22 (Attorney General Butterworth entered the
23 room.)
24 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: -- how much they
25 get paid.
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September 28, 1999
1 You can take and go on our website, and you
2 can pick any county; and you tell me how many
3 years a teacher's been teaching; you tell me
4 what their education is; and you can find a
5 little box, and that will tell you exactly how
6 much they're getting paid.
7 They could be one of the most dynamic
8 teachers, and exciting teachers that students
9 have ever had. Or they can be a dunce.
10 The bottom line is, that's what they get
11 paid.
12 And I think that's discouraging to good
13 teachers. I think it's discouraging to people
14 that really want to make a difference in a
15 classroom.
16 And so what we're doing here is we're
17 saying that when we have teachers that excel,
18 that go through the rigors to become a national
19 Board certified teacher in the -- in the
20 subject area that they teach, and show -- and
21 they have to do it through classroom
22 demonstrations as well as many, many other
23 things -- this will be one of the
24 qualifications, along with high student
25 improvement that these teachers have been able
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1 to demonstrate, which we're going to be able to
2 measure over the next year or two.
3 It will allow them to make twice the amount
4 of money that a -- that the average teacher
5 would make in that county, up to, as I say,
6 over $80,000 a year.
7 And that means that -- and they would be in
8 charge of a teaching unit, which could have
9 five levels of teachers. It's my belief, and
10 what we hope, that these districts will do with
11 these -- this pilot project, is will take this
12 money, set these 400 schools up in a manner
13 that will have the mentor teachers there.
14 It will give them an opportunity so that
15 when we recruit teachers, they'll know that
16 within five or ten years, they'll have an
17 opportunity, if they excel in the job of
18 teaching, and the job of getting students to
19 have improved learning, they will be able to
20 make eighty or more thousand dollars a year.
21 There is a good future in teachering, in --
22 not only the personal self-satisfaction that so
23 many teachers teach because of -- it certainly
24 isn't because of the money -- but they will be
25 rewarded in regards to money also.
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1 Half of that will be because they are
2 mentor teachers, so they could get up to 60,000
3 or more, the other 20,000 would be based on
4 student performance that they're in charge of,
5 along with the rest of their team.
6 And so I think that that probably will help
7 in recruitment, more than what the starting
8 salary is. Knowing that if you're good, you
9 care, and you do a good job with students,
10 you'll be able to -- to excel and -- and to
11 make a decent living -- a very good living as a
12 teacher in the state of Florida, because you're
13 a mentor teacher.
14 And that's my goal, and I -- I truly
15 believe that it -- from what -- everyone I've
16 talked to that are teachers -- teachers
17 themselves, I'm not talking about organized
18 labor or anything -- they're very excited about
19 the opportunity to -- to have that kind of an
20 income when, in fact, they do excel.
21 So that -- that I think is going to be a
22 very good recruitment method for the state.
23 TREASURER NELSON: Does the 20 million
24 dollars give you what you need, or is that just
25 a start?
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1 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Well, in many
2 cases, you could redesign a school and not cost
3 any more. But we believe that -- that in order
4 to do a real good job with those 400 schools to
5 come up with a good plan, we should fund that,
6 and that's why we asked for the 20 million.
7 TREASURER NELSON: Okay. Governor, I just
8 have one more question.
9 This was a question that I raised last year
10 when -- when -- when Chiles was here, and when
11 Frank Brogan was here.
12 And it's the question about with the new
13 standards on FCAT, the fact that we have
14 78 schools now listed as failing schools. And
15 if those schools were to be failing for the
16 second year in the row, then we have a
17 budgetary consideration for the future with
18 regard to the vouchers that would be available
19 to those 78 schools, not two schools.
20 So that instead of there being a few
21 students in two schools, and looking to the
22 future, what is the budgetary or financial
23 impact in providing for vouchers for the
24 future?
25 And so the question is: What has been
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1 considered in this budget with regard to that
2 future event occurring?
3 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: You're going to
4 probably hear the same answer from me that you
5 heard last time you asked the question.
6 And that is that the dollars follow the
7 student. And, in fact, there is absolutely no
8 impact on the budget whatsoever. There --
9 there may be impacts on district budgets where
10 they reallocate resources, sometimes quality
11 teachers, to those schools that are D and F
12 schools in order to -- to help those students.
13 There may be some allocations within a
14 district. We expect that to happen. That's
15 one of the reasons that when we're finished
16 this item, I'm going to talk about some
17 exciting things that we're doing to reward
18 those schools that truly have exceeded
19 expectations, and been highly improved schools,
20 either A schools, or those schools that have
21 shown wonderful improvement. When, in fact, we
22 know that some resources could be moved to
23 those D and F schools, we want to make sure
24 that we reward those schools that go above and
25 beyond.
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1 Now, in regards to budgetary constraints or
2 changes that need to be made in the budget
3 because some student's parents may choose to
4 send them with an opportunity scholarship,
5 either to another public school, well,
6 obviously the funding moves over to that other
7 public school, which is one of their choices.
8 At the two schools in Escambia County,
9 86 parents chose to do that, went to other
10 public schools. They could chose (sic) to go
11 to a private school, which will be their
12 option. Fifty-six parents chose to do that in
13 Escambia County.
14 And, in fact, the tuition that was paid was
15 a little less than what the county -- what the
16 district gets, so the district actually comes
17 out -- or the education budget comes out ahead,
18 because it did cost less to educate those
19 children in the private school with our public
20 money, because the money does follow the
21 student, to a maximum of what that tuition
22 and -- and fees are.
23 And so the bottom line is it does not have
24 a -- a budget change. Actually the system ends
25 up ahead if -- if students do leave and we do
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1 pay their tuition.
2 GOVERNOR BUSH: Another -- another fact
3 that -- that's pretty clear is that of the
4 78 schools, hypothetically, let's go to the
5 future here.
6 First of all, the good news -- and I think
7 Commissioner Gallagher's going to talk about
8 this on the next item. The good news is that
9 most of these schools are accepting the
10 challenge, and are going to have -- their kids
11 are going to benefit from a better education
12 because there is greater accountability now.
13 But whoever is -- whatever school in the
14 future will be F rated two years out of four,
15 there'll be opportunity scholarships given out,
16 that number will never exceed the student
17 population growth in any given year in Florida.
18 We -- we grow, Tom, at what, fifty --
19 forty-five to fifty thousand --
20 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: We --
21 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- to fifty-five
22 thousand --
23 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: We're figuring on
24 43,000 new students this year is what our
25 budget's based on. But that's --
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1 GOVERNOR BUSH: So if we're concerned --
2 which I'm not, to be honest with you -- but if
3 we're concerned about the overhead costs of the
4 public education system, which the -- the
5 question of whether money that leaves with the
6 child creates a strain on the overhead, which
7 is the place where it would, if we're concerned
8 about that, there -- we will have ample growth
9 of new students to be able to -- to spread that
10 overhead cost out over -- over a student body
11 population.
12 I think we ought to be child centered and
13 focus on the child's education, not worry about
14 the system. But others disagree, and -- but in
15 any case, it won't create financial hardship
16 for the school districts.
17 One -- one man's opinion, at least. We'll
18 find out.
19 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Governor,
20 I -- I just have one question.
21 I personally believe the school readiness
22 is a very, very important issue, Tom. I know
23 you -- that all of us have -- agree with that.
24 You say that the 41 million dollars
25 requested increase will -- will take
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1 12,000 kids off the list?
2 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: There -- it is our
3 estimate that there --
4 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Students.
5 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: -- are
6 12,000 students.
7 GOVERNOR BUSH: They're not even students
8 yet.
9 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: What's young --
10 young children --
11 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Children.
12 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: -- because these
13 are three and four years olds.
14 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Right.
15 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: There's a -- it's
16 our best knowledge that there is
17 approximately -- we believe, and it's really
18 hard to have a pinpoint on it, about
19 12,000 students that could be -- have on the
20 list -- on a waiting list to get into the pre-K
21 programs that we offer through our public
22 school system.
23 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: But how
24 many --
25 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: That has been in
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1 the past funded through lottery dollars.
2 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Right.
3 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: We believe it
4 should go over to general revenue is what we
5 did in the budget.
6 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Well, is
7 this going to be an additional number of
8 dollars, or it's still going to be the same
9 number of dollars, just -- just basically
10 supplanting the lottery dollars?
11 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: No. This is
12 for -- the -- what we've asked here is a
13 41 million dollar increase. The total amount
14 is at a couple hundred million dollars. This
15 is just a 41 million dollar increase.
16 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Well, how
17 many -- how many children then will there still
18 be out there that -- that needed the service
19 that will not be getting it, do you believe?
20 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: We hope that this
21 will cover all of those that we know whose
22 parents wanted, and were willing to bring them
23 to a public school pre-K program.
24 There are many, many other pre-K programs
25 that are funded through many other sources,
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1 Federal and State government. And the Depar--
2 it could come through the Department of Labor,
3 Wages, it could come through there with
4 child care, it could come through lots of
5 programs like that.
6 One of the things that we are trying to do
7 and get a handle on all this is to -- is the
8 committee met yesterday, Frank Brogan's the
9 chairman of it, and I am a member -- is the
10 Readiness Council that is looking into the
11 whole issue of readiness.
12 And the idea there is that they will
13 measure the student's outco-- in other words,
14 when they show up at kindergarten, they will
15 look at them and -- and measure their readiness
16 for school, go back and see what program they
17 came from, look at the funding source for that
18 program, and if it is money that comes through
19 the State -- through the Federal government or
20 the State, that if it -- if the program is
21 seeing to it that those children are
22 academically ready to be in school, we will
23 continue that program and hopefully expand it.
24 If we find out they aren't, then we're
25 going to let those students go to another pre-K
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1 program that is doing it.
2 And down the road, we'll be certifying
3 those programs and carrying out the -- the new
4 law which just went into effect.
5 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: If I could
6 continue, Governor?
7 GOVERNOR BUSH: Please.
8 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: I believe
9 this is probably the most important issue when
10 it comes to -- the opportunity scholarship
11 program, when it comes to failing schools and
12 defending this plan in court.
13 As -- as I believe that this is where we
14 have to put a major, major commitment in,
15 because if we don't, I believe that -- well,
16 I think our chance in court is less, but
17 I think also we're not being honest with the
18 public.
19 That -- there are many people out there
20 who, if their parents want them to -- to go to
21 a pre-K program or something else, and they
22 can't afford it, that's great, you have parents
23 that -- that really care and want to do it.
24 I think one of our -- one of our biggest
25 programs -- one of the biggest problems we
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1 have, Governor, is -- is, as you know, we have
2 many parents who -- who don't really know how
3 to be parents.
4 And their child coming into the -- the
5 kindergarten or -- or pre-K or elementary
6 schools, they're literally -- they're not ready
7 at all. And it's very, very sad, because we're
8 asking them to run a 100 yard dash, and having
9 them 75 yards behind. And I know there's a big
10 fervent up here to -- to get them doing that.
11 My office is working in conjunction with a
12 couple of school boards and Children and Family
13 and University of -- of South Florida to take a
14 couple of area codes, and deal with -- this'll
15 be areas where the Sheriff's Office will also
16 be having the -- the child protective services,
17 where we'll -- by working with the -- with
18 certain elementary schools that we'll target
19 that are probably D schools that -- that could
20 be F, that we're going to go in with very
21 little money right now -- this is all we
22 have -- in order to determine families that
23 have the needs.
24 You probably will have a child that might
25 be willing to learn, but you don't have a
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1 parent there who -- who cares about that child
2 learning.
3 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Well, they may
4 care, but not be able to do it.
5 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: That's
6 right. Care and -- and not be able to do it.
7 Now, if we can somehow or other -- this
8 41 million dollars, and the 12,000 children is
9 great.
10 If there's a way of having this almost
11 open-ended, Governor, as to where if we see a
12 real -- I think it's fair to -- it's fairer to
13 the schools, it's fairer to the children, it's
14 fairer to the school teachers, that if we're
15 going to help all we can to make sure that they
16 get a child there ready to learn.
17 And as we grade our schools, as we give
18 the -- the various evaluations of teachers and
19 everything else, I think this is a real, real
20 strong component of doing it. I'm not quite
21 sure exactly how to do it.
22 But I -- I just hope that more money could
23 be put into that particular program so as time
24 goes on, and through your travels, and the
25 Lieutenant Governor's travels, and -- and Tom's
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1 travels, that if you can -- if we see certain
2 populations going into -- into various
3 elementary schools where the kids are not
4 ready, and they're not ready because it's not
5 the kid's fault, that if we can do something --
6 GOVERNOR BUSH: Absolutely.
7 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: -- with
8 Children and Family.
9 GOVERNOR BUSH: One of --
10 Commissioner Nelson brought up the -- I like
11 the term remediation fund better, because I
12 can't remember the other one.
13 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: S-A-I.
14 GOVERNOR BUSH: Well, that's an acronym. I
15 can't use that.
16 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: But it's better.
17 GOVERNOR BUSH: Against --
18 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: No more acronyms.
19 Okay.
20 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- against my religion.
21 But the remediation fund can be used
22 literally to deal with the -- prevent the need
23 for remediation. I mean, my hope would be
24 that, you know, we're going to test grades 3
25 through 10.
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1 If children learn how to read at basic
2 grade level by the third grade, they're then on
3 a platform that they can acquire knowledge and
4 social studies, science, and all the other
5 things. They'll be able to -- to think in
6 abstract ways to be able to gain the knowledge.
7 The best way to eliminate social promotion
8 and all of the flaws in our system that have
9 been organized around the fact that kids were
10 learning is to prevent it from happening, the
11 need to remediate in -- in the beginning.
12 And I know the Commissioner is committed to
13 this with the reading initiatives. There's a
14 lot more pre-K, as well as those first
15 K through 2 years that we can focus on.
16 For example, Commissioner, on the -- on the
17 early -- on the smaller class sizes, we -- we
18 have made a commitment at the State level to
19 lower class sizes.
20 My personal belief is, and most school
21 districts are going along with this, they are
22 lowering the class size of kindergarten and
23 first and second grade as their -- as their
24 main priority to deal with this same issue that
25 really it's -- it's grades, you know, when
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1 you're three year olds to the time you're in
2 second grade is where more effort ought to be
3 made, I think.
4 And I agree with your assessment, and --
5 and in our budget we'll be looking at early
6 childhood type initiatives, both in terms of
7 academics -- or we're shifting to academics in
8 pre-K work. Before it was more baby-sitting --
9 and in healthcare as well. The Kid Care
10 Program I think is an element of this as well.
11 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Let me just
12 mention two things to -- to emphasize what
13 you're saying, General.
14 If we look at the average inner city child
15 that shows up at one of these D -- D or F
16 schools, they have about a 1,000 word
17 vocabulary. And in some cases, we wish they
18 didn't use some of those words.
19 They don't know their colors --
20 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: They can
21 spell them all probably though.
22 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Yeah. I don't
23 think they can spell them either.
24 They -- they don't know their colors, they
25 don't know their numbers, they don't know their
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1 shapes, they don't know --
2 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: That's
3 right.
4 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: -- letters.
5 And the average middle class student shows
6 up with a 5,000 word vocabulary, they have some
7 social graces that are appreciated when they
8 show up at kindergarten, they know their
9 colors, their shapes, their numbers, their
10 letters, they know words, they've had the same
11 book read to them 250 times. Name one of those
12 words wrong, and you'll get straightened right
13 out.
14 And so with that huge difference, as you
15 mentioned, it's the 100 yard or 75 yard dash,
16 one child's 80 percent behind basically.
17 And what you're doing is you have a
18 tremendously tough teaching job for those
19 teachers in those schools.
20 And that's why it's so important that we --
21 that the districts find the best principal
22 leaders, because that's what makes the
23 difference in a good school.
24 We're going to talk about -- as soon as
25 we're done with my budget here, I'm going to
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1 talk about some schools and how great they've
2 done because of good principal leadership, and
3 the ability to have the right teachers in those
4 schools.
5 But the important thing in regards to the
6 readiness is that this Commission that started
7 out as a -- is it going -- is not one that just
8 is here and gone. It is there to direct the
9 funds, any funds that go to pre-K programs, and
10 it will work with local commissions that will
11 be doing the same thing, directing those funds
12 and measuring the outcome of pre-K programs
13 throughout this state.
14 And we're right on -- that was a major
15 thing I talked about when I was campaigning for
16 this office was the readiness area. And
17 it's -- it's happening now. There will be
18 criteria of expectations for young children
19 that enter kindergarten, and they will be set
20 by this Commission. And the law says they'll
21 be set by next June.
22 So there's some real exciting things
23 happening in the readiness. And we know with
24 new brain research, 50 percent of all human
25 learning takes place between zero and
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1 five years old. We don't get them in
2 kindergarten till six.
3 So it's so important that we as a society
4 take responsibility when, in fact, the parents
5 are not able to provide that early childhood
6 training.
7 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Governor,
8 I -- I complete-- I completely agree. And --
9 and from the standpoint -- and, again, back to
10 the point that I'm not sure we have enough
11 money in this program, even with what you have
12 now. If we have forty-five,
13 fifty-five thousand new kids every year, the
14 amount of money you have in this program
15 doesn't even cover that many kids.
16 If you're a principal of an elementary
17 school, and you really want to do a good job, I
18 would certainly think you would want to partner
19 with the feeder communities for your particular
20 school in order to make sure that you have a
21 child that is ready.
22 And you may not only want to have a
23 principal who -- and an administrator in that
24 school, you may also want to have a principal
25 outside the school, a principal of the
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1 community whereby that principal is in charge
2 of what comes to that particular school.
3 And working with Children and Family
4 Services and local law enforcement. And those
5 are the two agencies that -- with such
6 dedicated people that they see the families
7 when they're -- when they're at their lowest,
8 they see the kids who -- who -- they -- they
9 feel so sorry for, because they know they're
10 not going to have a chance in the system.
11 And I can tell you right now, if -- if we
12 do what we should do in this area right here,
13 our future legislators are not going to have to
14 fund prisons. And county commissions are not
15 going to have to fund jails. Because
16 90 percent of people in jails and prisons, as
17 we all know, don't go to school. These are the
18 most important years you'll agree to.
19 And -- and also the health issue, Governor.
20 I -- it's fantastic. I -- I spent a couple
21 years of my life outside of Tallahassee, and --
22 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: And a couple of --
23 of days a month.
24 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: And a couple
25 of days --
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1 In -- in places like Washington, Chicago,
2 Memphis, Atlanta, all over this country sitting
3 across the table from tobacco companies. And
4 we received quite a bit of money from those
5 companies.
6 I mean, we have a -- in round numbers, a
7 billion dollars a year for four years, last
8 year, and for the next three years, 400 million
9 thereafter.
10 I would love to see a -- more money going
11 into this program. I mean, this is very
12 important to me. It's very important to
13 everybody else. And I did a lot of blood,
14 sweat, and tears to bring all that money back,
15 I'd love --
16 GOVERNOR BUSH: You want your commission.
17 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: -- I want my
18 commission but --
19 GOVERNOR BUSH: Your contingency fee.
20 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: I -- I want
21 my contingency fee. And I want it to go to the
22 children of the state of Florida for early
23 education and for healthcare. It's as simple
24 as that.
25 If the lawyers received from tobacco
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1 company, whatever they got, well, I'll take the
2 same percentage, and I -- and I want it to go
3 right -- right to these kids.
4 And I -- and I'm just concerned about --
5 about limiting the number, that if we can
6 have -- like I say, this thing open-ended to
7 where we -- we could have some legislative
8 language that -- that -- that the Commissioner
9 could draw down upon that particular thing, if
10 we find that there are -- are more kids, and
11 some school boards come up with some tremendous
12 ideas to put that principal in the
13 neighborhood.
14 And working with the -- with Children and
15 Family Services, I just think we -- we'd have a
16 tremendous program here, and we'd really make
17 this A+ an A double plus plan.
18 GOVERNOR BUSH: That's a winner.
19 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Well, let me just
20 say one other thing real quickly. And that is
21 that pretty soon this won't be part of our --
22 of our budgeting. This -- this new Commission
23 that's been designed in the law will be the
24 entity that will go fight for that money.
25 So we won't be talking about whether we're
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1 going to have money in the K through 12, and
2 how much we're going to put in pre-K. They're
3 going to be out with their own budget, with the
4 Lieutenant Governor heading it up, setting up
5 how much money they want for these pre-K
6 programs.
7 I'm real glad of that. That means that
8 we're not saying that -- whether it's going to
9 be in K through 12 money, or whether -- who
10 always -- everybody's grabbing. It's not going
11 to be in the university budget, it's not going
12 to be in the community college budget. It's
13 going to have its own entity, which is exactly
14 what you're talking about.
15 They're going to look and see what the
16 needs are for those children. And they're
17 going to be coming to the Governor and the
18 Legislature for the funding for those children.
19 I think it's -- it's a very good thing that
20 we don't -- that we do it this way, as opposed
21 to that -- that thing, well, you know, we
22 really don't want to take that money from
23 the -- the K -- the elementary school, and give
24 it to those other ones who are fighting back
25 and forth. This way they will get the money,
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1 and -- and be responsible for those children to
2 be ready for school.
3 GOVERNOR BUSH: General Milligan.
4 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Yes, sir, I hate to
5 prolong this, but there is a -- a very
6 successful program that addresses many of these
7 issues that have been talked about, that
8 unfortunately I was not able to see where it
9 was receiving any funding support.
10 It's a program that basically provides
11 mentors in the community. They live in the
12 community, they live in the housing projects,
13 they mentor in the schools, they teach in the
14 schools, they become surrogate parents, they
15 fill all of the things you're talking about,
16 whether you're talking about a three year old
17 that's being helped, or a -- a thirteen
18 year old that's being helped.
19 And -- and this program just never seems to
20 get very much support, albeit, it has been
21 extraordinarily successful in the Orlando area
22 under the University of Central Florida. And
23 I'm talking about the Soldiers to Scholars
24 Program.
25 And I saw no funding in there for that
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1 particular program. A program that if anybody
2 ever goes to witness it, cannot help but to be
3 an extraordinary supporter of it.
4 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: That has primarily
5 been a Federally -- assisted Federally funded
6 project, as you may know. And that is one of
7 the projects that is in the 50 million dollar
8 pot. So it is in there.
9 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Well -- well, I hope
10 so. And if -- and if you as individuals have
11 not visited this program, I would recommend you
12 do it. And it's something that ought to be
13 expanded throughout the state of Florida.
14 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Actually, General,
15 where they have their offices is a project --
16 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Oh, I've been there,
17 know it well.
18 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: -- as soon as they
19 opened up their offices, they all thought they
20 were narcs or something, didn't know what it
21 was. And the whole project cleaned up, wasn't
22 a bit of drug exchanges or use in that project
23 because -- because the soldiers were hanging
24 around and -- and doing their job.
25 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: And there still
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1 isn't.
2 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: That's right. I
3 know there isn't. They've cleaned that whole
4 place up real quick.
5 GOVERNOR BUSH: Any other comments?
6 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Governor, I
7 don't know if it's appropriate or not. But is
8 there a way to amend this to -- if we agree --
9 well, I guess we're really not locked in, so
10 maybe -- but the -- that tobacco money will be
11 the -- that the first look at tobacco money
12 will be towards education of the children of
13 the state of Florida, and healthcare for
14 children of the state of Florida?
15 TREASURER NELSON: Governor, the idea would
16 be that we would be expressing the sense of the
17 Governor and the Cabinet sitting as the State
18 Board of Education, that the -- that the
19 tobacco money ought to be going for what the
20 Attorney General articulated, which is school
21 readiness and children's health. Get those
22 children ready to -- for school.
23 GOVERNOR BUSH: Well, the Legislature
24 passed as part of the -- the nonrecurring
25 elements of the tobacco settlement, those first
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1 four years, passed an endowment. The endowment
2 includes part of what you're describing, not
3 all of it. It includes children's health
4 issues. The Kid Care Program was funded not to
5 the full extent of what we -- what I proposed,
6 but increased.
7 And it includes child -- the child welfare
8 system -- the revamping of the child welfare
9 system; the aging in place strategy; and then
10 in addition to what we propose, the Legislature
11 passed an element that included research
12 dollars for cancer at one of the three or four
13 cancer institutes in the -- in the state.
14 Now, in addition to that, there's the
15 400 million dollars of -- 450 million dollars
16 of recurring revenue for the next 20 years.
17 And that -- that money, from my perspective, I
18 view that as general revenue dollars. And
19 everybody looks at me like I'm crazy.
20 But it's -- it's un-- it's -- it's -- has
21 the similar -- has similarities to general
22 revenue in that it can be used as we want to.
23 Unlike trust funds dollars that are -- that are
24 tied to a specific program.
25 And in that regard, I do not know if any of
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1 the tobacco money right now is being used for
2 any of the readiness programs. I do know that
3 it's used for a variety of different health
4 issues again.
5 TREASURER NELSON: Well --
6 GOVERNOR BUSH: Allocating -- tagging --
7 you know, I'm going to -- I'm not going to --
8 I'm going to use my prerogative as Governor to
9 take a pass on -- on the passing of the
10 resolution on all these items, just because
11 we're in the -- we're in the process of
12 building our budget.
13 You all clearly could make a
14 recommendation -- or make an amendment,
15 I guess, to -- to Commissioner Gallagher's
16 budget, whether or not the Legislature will go
17 along with that. My guess is they'll continue
18 to fund what has been established if it's
19 recurring. That would be my --
20 TREASURER NELSON: If I might respond, I
21 agree. I think the Legislature will do what
22 the Legislature wants to do. But --
23 GOVERNOR BUSH: True.
24 TREASURER NELSON: -- we are sitting here
25 as the State Board of Education.
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1 GOVERNOR BUSH: Uh-hum.
2 TREASURER NELSON: And the Attorney General
3 has just articulated something from his toil,
4 which has benefited this state enormously, and
5 we are now at the cusp of being able to make a
6 difference in children's lives by getting them
7 more ready by the time that they enter
8 kindergarten.
9 And the money is there, and --
10 GOVERNOR BUSH: All I'm saying --
11 TREASURER NELSON: -- if the
12 Attorney General so chooses, I'm certainly
13 going to support --
14 GOVERNOR BUSH: Absolutely.
15 TREASURER NELSON: -- an amendment, or
16 resolution, or whatever -- whatever he deems
17 appropriate.
18 GOVERNOR BUSH: It's -- that's -- and
19 it's -- within your prerogative to do that.
20 All I'm suggesting is, this is not new
21 money. In other words, there is no new money.
22 The tobacco money is -- has been committed to,
23 based on the budget. So it would be taking
24 something else that would be of less priority.
25 That was the only point I was making.
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1 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: And let me just
2 say this: That we expect the
3 Readiness Commission that is set up, has only
4 had its first meeting, which was yesterday,
5 to -- their job is to tell us what they --
6 they're going to have their own budget.
7 And they're going to have to come to us --
8 I don't know whether it comes through us or it
9 goes directly to the Governor.
10 But they need to -- they're going to be
11 looking at all of the streams of funding for
12 pre-K programs. This is one stream of funding
13 that exists for -- for pre-K programs.
14 The wages boards have another -- other
15 streams of funding. Department of Labor has
16 other streams of funding.
17 GOVERNOR BUSH: Head Start.
18 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: There's
19 Head Starts streams -- I mean, there's just so
20 many Federal and State streams of funding. I
21 don't -- I don't -- one of the reasons the
22 Readiness Board is so important is, get a
23 handle on what they all are, and where they all
24 are, and how much money is there, and what we
25 need.
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1 We're looking here at only the programs
2 that are in the public education area that is
3 in the -- that basically are housed in
4 elementary schools. And we're covering what we
5 know as the waiting list for those.
6 There are plenty of other programs and
7 plenty of other children being taken care of,
8 some, unfortunately, with the lady down the
9 street, and they drop four or five kids off,
10 and there they are. And there's -- there's
11 thousands of those.
12 And some of them are great, because they
13 give them some good academics; and some of
14 them, you know, get a meal and a bed.
15 So I can tell you, I'm comfortable that
16 we're funding what needs to be funded in the
17 ones that we, as the Board, have authority
18 over. Those that we don't have now been
19 centralized in this new Commission that's
20 supposed to handle the rest of the funding.
21 And I think knowing the people that are on
22 there, they're going to diligently look for the
23 dollars that are needed for every single child
24 we have.
25 So I'm willing to go along with what you
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1 want. But I -- but the -- other than the
2 public school funding that I know we're
3 covering here, we need to go to that Commission
4 with the -- with the other funding process.
5 GOVERNOR BUSH: General.
6 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Governor,
7 I'm -- I -- I've never served in the
8 Legislative branch.
9 GOVERNOR BUSH: Me neither.
10 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: And I -- I'm
11 not quite sure I concur that the -- that
12 tobacco money should be considered recurring
13 money, because we don't know what's going to
14 happen from the standpoint of the Federal
15 lawsuit, will the bank -- will the -- will the
16 tobacco companies go belly-up.
17 We think it'll take a number of years
18 before that happens. I don't think it's going
19 to affect us during any of our tenures here.
20 The -- it's -- if -- as we hope, that the
21 price of cigarettes will go up so high that
22 the -- that there'll be less sales, and,
23 therefore, of course, our -- our revenue's
24 going to be less.
25 And there's always been, I think, all of
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1 our hope that -- that there will be no -- no
2 children starting smoking, and adults
3 definitely rethinking their decision.
4 But even as we were discussing this issue
5 at a national level, and -- and trying to
6 protect the money as -- as all of us work so
7 hard to do from the Federal government taking
8 55 percent of Florida money, we were -- we were
9 looking to -- to -- to putting this money
10 into -- into areas of healthcare and education,
11 and some elderly issues, in order to help
12 guarantee that the money is staying in the
13 state.
14 And I -- and I would encourage in the
15 strongest way that -- that we keep true with
16 that particular philosophy as -- as we were --
17 even on the last day, on August 25th of '97, as
18 we were hammering out the -- the agreement with
19 tobacco, that was a paragraph that was put in
20 there, that this is where we wanted to spend
21 the money, and that we -- even though we --
22 even though we knew we could not bind the
23 Legislature, or any future governors on that.
24 But -- but the thing that I -- I just think
25 in order to be true to the people, I -- I would
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1 hope that we would ask the Legislature to look
2 at that tobacco money, and before they do
3 anything else with it, to -- to look towards
4 the needs of -- of our children as it comes to
5 education and healthcare.
6 And I make that as a motion to it -- as an
7 amendment to this particular item.
8 GOVERNOR BUSH: There's a motion to the
9 item.
10 TREASURER NELSON: And I second.
11 GOVERNOR BUSH: There's a second.
12 Before we vote, I -- again, I'm -- I am
13 sympathetic to the intent here --
14 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Right.
15 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- but I'm going to
16 withhold my vote, and reserve the right to make
17 separate recommendations to the Legislature.
18 I do want to tell you that one of the more
19 interesting things that I've experienced as
20 Governor was one of the first -- the first
21 weeks of the job, I went to Washington for the
22 NGA meeting, and President Clinton is there in
23 his -- in the east room, and it's -- I knew a
24 lot of people that were serving in the -- in
25 the White House, so it was a pretty moving
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1 experience.
2 And right out of the -- the first sentence
3 of the President's speech, he commended our
4 efforts as it related -- as it relates to how
5 the tobacco dollars are being spent, and paid
6 tribute to Governor Chiles and to you, and a
7 little bit to me, which was the part that was a
8 little strange, for our commitment to making
9 sure that Florida spent the money wisely. And
10 not many states have followed suit.
11 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Not many.
12 GOVERNOR BUSH: And so I appreciate what
13 you're saying very much about the intent of
14 where this money needs to go.
15 I believe we have been -- remained true to
16 the settlement that you reached. A lot of
17 other places are building roads and a lot of
18 things that really are way off the beaten path.
19 So --
20 There's a motion and a second.
21 Any discussion?
22 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: What -- could I
23 have that motion clarified?
24 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Just that
25 the -- that the Legislature, before they use
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1 the tobacco settlement money for any other
2 purpose, they look towards meeting the unmet
3 needs for -- for educ--
4 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Great.
5 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: -- for
6 children's education --
7 GOVERNOR BUSH: Early childhood --
8 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: -- early
9 childhood --hood issues, and educational
10 issues, and -- and health issues.
11 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Great.
12 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: As -- as the intent
13 of the settlement.
14 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: As the
15 intent of the settlement of --
16 GOVERNOR BUSH: I support that.
17 Okay. There is an amendment, I guess we
18 vote on that first.
19 All in favor?
20 THE CABINET: Aye.
21 GOVERNOR BUSH: All opposed?
22 Aye. Me.
23 Now, how are we -- the rest of this
24 process, Tom, please explain it to me since you
25 have the university budget and the community
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1 college budget. Is this all one resolution --
2 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: We're --
3 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- or --
4 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: -- we can do that,
5 or we can separate them. Either one. I think
6 they pretty much --
7 GOVERNOR BUSH: How would you like to do
8 it?
9 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Let's go ahead and
10 get this one done, and --
11 GOVERNOR BUSH: Okay.
12 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: -- then we'll
13 listen to the next one.
14 I'll move the --
15 GOVERNOR BUSH: Is there --
16 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: -- the K-12
17 budget.
18 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- a second?
19 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Second.
20 GOVERNOR BUSH: It -- all -- all in favor
21 of the budget as amended --
22 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Aye.
23 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- say aye.
24 THE CABINET: Aye.
25 GOVERNOR BUSH: Opposed.
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1 Again, I -- I vote no.
2 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Well, you could
3 withhold, instead of making it look --
4 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Abstain.
5 GOVERNOR BUSH: I'm --
6 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: -- like it's bad,
7 Governor.
8 GOVERNOR BUSH: All right.
9 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Abstain.
10 GOVERNOR BUSH: It's not bad. I'm just --
11 I'm just trying to exercise my right as
12 Governor to submit my budget. I'm not trying
13 to be respectful.
14 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: You could abstain.
15 GOVERNOR BUSH: Whatever the appropriate
16 thing that Governor Chiles did, I'll do that.
17 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: He made a
18 very, very long statement.
19 GOVERNOR BUSH: Did he?
20 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: A very long
21 statement.
22 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Graham, Chiles,
23 Martinez usually just didn't vote, reserving
24 the right to look over --
25 GOVERNOR BUSH: Okay.
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1 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: -- the budget,
2 any --
3 GOVERNOR BUSH: That's what --
4 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: -- changes needed.
5 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- I just did.
6 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Okay.
7 GOVERNOR BUSH: Get a special first year
8 exemption.
9 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: With the
10 exception of tobacco, right?
11 GOVERNOR BUSH: Yeah.
12 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Oh, Lord.
13 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: We have
14 presentations from -- I guess we want to do
15 community colleges next?
16 GOVERNOR BUSH: David.
17 MS. ARMSTRONG: Thank you, Governor, and
18 Cabinet members. Appreciate you giving us a
19 few moments to hit the highlights of our budget
20 request for this upcoming year.
21 This budget request is an effort, growing
22 out of our five-year strategic plan that we
23 adopted last year that tries to answer
24 basically one question: What can Florida
25 Community College system do to serve the
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1 citizens of the state of Florida.
2 We have identified about six major areas
3 that we want to focus on, and the budget
4 request flows with that strategic plan.
5 The first area that we're asking for are
6 55 million dollars in increases over last year
7 is in what we're calling our adequacy budget.
8 That is basically the minimum standards that we
9 need to continue the quality teaching and
10 learning in our faculty, the quality teaching
11 and learning in our support services as a
12 one-time increase for 7.5 million dollars in
13 library books to bring our libraries up to
14 speed.
15 It also has enough money in there to
16 support salary increases consistent with the
17 increase that you're looking at for State
18 employees.
19 Now, the colleges, fortunately, have
20 flexibility in what they do with those salary
21 dollars, because we're going through a lot of
22 turnover right now. Most of our colleges are
23 25 to 30 years old, and so naturally faculty
24 members are about that old, and they're turning
25 over.
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1 As that happens, we're hiring in new
2 faculty members, especially in high tech areas
3 that are going to cost more than some of the
4 older faculty members that we had in English
5 and social sciences and those sorts of things.
6 Information technology experts cost more,
7 unfortunately.
8 So basic minimum standards.
9 The second area for us is in the area of
10 work force. And I know that you know, because
11 you're hearing from business and industry just
12 like I do, that work force and a trained work
13 force is one of the key elements that we've got
14 to put some focus on in this state that we've
15 been lacking.
16 Florida Chamber of Commerce told me that
17 they just recently completed their annual
18 survey of their membership. What are the top
19 priorities in this state?
20 Last year, it was work force,
21 overwhelmingly. This year it's work force even
22 stronger, more than education in general, and
23 some other components.
24 So we are launching out into an initiative,
25 Governor and Cabinet members, to identify with
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1 local, community, Chamber, and economic
2 development experts, what are the top jobs that
3 you want us to prepare students for to help
4 recruit and retain businesses and grow with
5 businesses that exist in your local community.
6 So we have an initiative here that's asking
7 for 30 million dollars to start up new
8 programs, most of them in the technology areas,
9 but linking up with the --
10 (Treasurer Nelson exited the room.)
11 MS. ARMSTRONG: -- economic development
12 initiatives of the state.
13 We're continuing to ask you to support the
14 performance challenge that we have had for
15 five years now. While our enrollment has been
16 relatively flat, our productivity and increase
17 in number of degrees and certificates awarded
18 has gone up over the last five years
19 approximately 20 percent.
20 So our productivity, supported by this
21 performance budgeting increase, we think will
22 continue that.
23 Another very important thing for us, you
24 just had a wonderful discussion, more
25 discussion than I've ever heard the Cabinet
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1 have on the education budget, about the need to
2 deal with some of the remediation and dropout
3 prevention issues.
4 We believe we've got to reach out to our
5 public schools and form a partnership with
6 them, much like we've had with our public
7 universities for many years, that is lauded
8 around this nation.
9 We've got to do that with public schools.
10 When we have 50 percent, approximately, of our
11 students who are dropping out between ninth and
12 twelve grade; when we have last year's
13 high school graduates coming to community
14 colleges, 60 plus percent of them need some
15 level of remediation.
16 We have got to reach out, and it's our
17 responsibility, as it is everybody's, to work
18 with our public schools to do more.
19 So we have a budget request --
20 GOVERNOR BUSH: How are you going to do
21 that?
22 MS. ARMSTRONG: Dual enrollment programs
23 where students can give opp-- have
24 opportunities to get their associates degree at
25 the same time they get their -- their --
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1 GOVERNOR BUSH: Isn't that -- isn't that
2 related to the -- the -- most of the young men
3 and women that I see in high school that are
4 taking dual enrollment courses are bright and
5 energetic, they're not the ones that would come
6 to the community colleges later to seek
7 remediation.
8 MS. ARMSTRONG: That -- that is largely
9 true, Governor. What we're going to try to do
10 is expand that dual enrollment program so that
11 it not only just focuses on the traditional
12 college credit who go on to our universities,
13 some of them to us, but also a parallel track
14 that is --
15 GOVERNOR BUSH: Okay.
16 MS. ARMSTRONG: -- dual enrollment focused
17 on these wonderful occupational programs that
18 we have, that a two-year degree or a one-year
19 certificate can give them a great job. So --
20 GOVERNOR BUSH: Okay.
21 MS. ARMSTRONG: -- that will give them new
22 opportunities.
23 So the -- the fourth challenge for us then
24 is in the area of technology.
25 Commissioner Gallagher talked about increases
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1 for K-12.
2 We, too, are expanding our course
3 offerings, and, therefore, opportunities for
4 students to take courses on-line.
5 We now -- you can log in to our web site,
6 www.distancelearn.org, and you will find
7 1500 courses offered on-line and through other
8 distance learning methods for -- that Florida
9 citizens can access through our
10 community colleges.
11 We want to expand that. Part of this
12 request also is a partnership we have with our
13 universities where we're -- we're developing
14 on-line counseling services, so high school
15 students can log in and determine what they
16 want to go into, and what they'll need to take
17 to be able to be prepared for that.
18 Finally is a continuation of our
19 partnership challenge, which is our matching
20 grant programs, which is one of the real
21 successes in this state. Private business and
22 industry provides contributions to our
23 colleges, it supports scholarships, et cetera.
24 And, Governor, let me also just mention
25 that facilities is going to continue to be an
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1 issue for all of us in education, I know, but
2 higher education in particular, where we have
3 not had the good fortune of some bond issues,
4 through lottery or anything else.
5 PECO is down over the last five years for
6 our system, and similar for the universities I
7 know. Five years ago, we had approximately
8 230 million dollars. This year our allocation
9 is 90 million dollars.
10 Even though we haven't had growth, our
11 buildings are old, and we have a backlog of
12 renovation and remodeling needs. So we have
13 focused priority of our PECO on those
14 renovation remodeling needs.
15 We're asking you for additional funds over
16 that -- or asking the Legislature to
17 appropriate it, if additional nonrecurring
18 funds are available especially.
19 And then we also have a separate pot to
20 support these additional work force programs
21 that we're moving into, retrofitting some
22 existing buildings with laboratories for
23 technology, et cetera.
24 Thank you very much, Governor. Be happy to
25 answer any questions.
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1 GOVERNOR BUSH: Thank you, David.
2 Any comments?
3 SECRETARY HARRIS: I have a question.
4 GOVERNOR BUSH: Yeah.
5 SECRETARY HARRIS: I think the
6 community colleges have done an outstanding job
7 in all the areas that you've mentioned, and
8 technology certainly will be our next
9 challenge.
10 In these increases, and I was just looking
11 at the -- the data from the -- the rule change,
12 you said that your enrollment had sort of
13 flat lined, and I was trying to do the math
14 without a calculator.
15 But there's still -- it looks like it's
16 actually decreasing --
17 MS. ARMSTRONG: The -- well, actually this
18 year, our preliminary numbers for this fall
19 looks like we're up somewhere between 2 and
20 3 percent.
21 The head count enrollment that I think
22 you're probably looking at, has decreased
23 pretty significantly over the last five years.
24 Our head count to -- to FTE ratio is
25 approximately 4 to 1. It takes 4 heads to make
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1 1 FTE in our system, because it's
2 nontraditional students --
3 SECRETARY HARRIS: I was trying to -- I
4 have them both. I was trying to --
5 MR. ARMSTRONG: Exactly.
6 SECRETARY HARRIS: -- figure out exactly
7 how that worked.
8 MS. ARMSTRONG: The main impact on
9 enrollment in our system, Secretary Harris, has
10 been the strong economy. Our nontraditional
11 adult students, when the economy is strong,
12 unemployment is low, are working more. They're
13 taking maybe one class, instead of three
14 classes. And so that's been the primary
15 effect.
16 SECRETARY HARRIS: Has Bright Futures
17 Scholarships, have they impacted you in any --
18 in any way that you're able to measure?
19 MS. ARMSTRONG: We're in the process of
20 looking at the Bright Futures. The -- we've
21 talked with the Commissioner and with the
22 Lieutenant Governor, the Chancellor and I have,
23 at some ways that we think maybe together we
24 could make some improvements in that, as well
25 as some of the other financial aid programs.
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1 We're strongly supportive of the increase
2 that the Commissioner has recommended in need
3 based financial aid, which is very important to
4 a lot of our students especially.
5 But we've also got some other programs.
6 The Gold Seal Program, which should target the
7 vocational students, has kind of lost its focus
8 over the years, and so we're talking about
9 maybe redesigning that program also.
10 So we're trying to look at --
11 SECRETARY HARRIS: That'd be --
12 MS. ARMSTRONG: -- the whole package --
13 SECRETARY HARRIS: -- a good idea.
14 MR. ARMSTRONG: -- of financial aid.
15 SECRETARY HARRIS: Thank you.
16 MS. ARMSTRONG: Thank you.
17 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: I'd like to move
18 the community college budget.
19 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Second.
20 GOVERNOR BUSH: There's a motion --
21 SECRETARY HARRIS: Second.
22 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- and second.
23 All in favor?
24 THE CABINET: Aye.
25 GOVERNOR BUSH: I will withhold my vote,
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1 and reserve the right to make separate
2 recommendations to the legislative process.
3 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Okay. Governor,
4 if we could have Chancellor Herbert.
5 GOVERNOR BUSH: Chancellor.
6 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: That was already
7 there.
8 GOVERNOR BUSH: Yes. In yellow, too. I
9 just wasn't -- I'm not very good at the script.
10 DR. HERBERT: Thank you very much,
11 Governor, members of the Cabinet. I appreciate
12 this opportunity to briefly present to you --
13 (Secretary Harris exited the room.)
14 DR. HERBERT: -- the State University
15 System budget request.
16 Last year the Board of Regents adopted a
17 strategic plan that outlines the goals and
18 philosophy of the State University System as we
19 seek to address a number of critical needs in
20 this state.
21 Each of the budget issues that -- that I
22 will present to you this morning is tied back
23 to one of the six fundamental goals included in
24 that plan.
25 I would just note that among them are, one,
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1 the -- the goal of establishing the State
2 University System as one of the top five
3 university systems in America.
4 And also we're committed to offering our
5 academic programs in a much more comprehensive
6 fashion to assure that we are much more
7 effective -- effective in responding to -- to
8 the needs of all sections of this state.
9 For the -- for the SUS to become one of the
10 best university systems in America, it must, as
11 you know, establish an academic community of
12 excellence in which each of our universities
13 has a clearly defined mission, and related
14 implementation goals.
15 Last year, as part of our strategic plan,
16 that mission classification framework was
17 developed.
18 And we want to thank the members of this
19 Cabinet and the Governor, as well as the
20 Legislature, for helping to set that mission
21 into -- into effect through the adoption of the
22 1999 Legislative Budget Request.
23 Rather than focusing on each of the
24 elements of our request, there are 24 basic
25 items in addition to care for refunds -- in
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1 addition to the recurring revenue requests.
2 Rather than focusing on those, I'd like to
3 just highlight six specific issues that we
4 believe are critical to the long-term
5 development of the State University System.
6 The first is a request for 20 million
7 dollars to strengthen the universities'
8 infrastructure. The 1999 Legislature adopted a
9 portion of this request last year.
10 However, additional funding is needed to
11 make the -- the significant infrastructure
12 improvements that we need.
13 (Secretary Harris entered the room.)
14 DR. HERBERT: I would just tell you that
15 the -- the 20 million dollar infrastructure
16 funding that we are requesting would provide an
17 additional $142 per Full-Time Equivalent
18 student.
19 And to put that into a national
20 perspective, the SUS is still $665 per FTE
21 behind the national average. But these funds
22 are very important because they provide a basic
23 maintenance level for equipment, expenses, and
24 electronic data processing, as well as enabling
25 us to replace obsolete equipment.
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1 Obviously in a higher educational setting,
2 this is a very critical issue.
3 The second major request relates to faculty
4 and staff salaries. The State University
5 System is requesting approximately 12 million
6 dollars for market equity, and another
7 12.5 million for faculty and staff performance
8 incentives.
9 The most critical success factor in
10 achieving the goals of our strategic plan, and
11 also our performance based budgeting goals is
12 an energized, diverse, and also a competitive
13 work force.
14 You may recall that about 15 years ago, in
15 your capacity as the State Board of Education,
16 this body adopted the goal of reaching the
17 upper quartile among all states in various
18 categories of educational quality, including
19 faculty salaries.
20 Today, we are further behind in the
21 achievement of this as it relates to faculty
22 salaries than we were when the goal was first
23 articulated by the Cabinet.
24 Using 1997-98 data, just to give you an
25 example -- and these are -- are the most recent
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1 data that we have available -- SUS fac--
2 salaries for professors are approximately
3 $12,000 below the national average.
4 When you combine all ranks, our salaries
5 are approximately $10,000 below the national
6 average.
7 What we're attempting to do is to build one
8 of the top five university systems in America.
9 And if we're going to do that, if we're going
10 to continue to stress the importance of
11 performance, it's absolutely essential that we
12 have a -- a salary structure that is reflective
13 of the level of commitment to excellence that
14 we have articulated.
15 This same point applies in the context that
16 Commissioner Gallagher was talking about
17 earlier in the context of K through 12.
18 So we would like to continue to modify our
19 pay system so that we can more effectively
20 reward individuals who make the greatest
21 contribution to the academic enterprise.
22 We want to reward high levels of quality
23 and performance. And our belief is that --
24 that salary increases linked to performance
25 will help us to retain highly productive world
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1 class faculty who are going to assist us in
2 achieving our broader system goals.
3 The third issue is related to student
4 access, the baccalaureate to graduate and
5 professional education, as well as enrollment
6 growth at the ten universities.
7 As you know, Florida lags behind the rest
8 of the nation in the number of baccalaureate
9 degrees it awards each year.
10 This puts our state at a handicap in
11 attracting new business, and also in expanding
12 existing industry.
13 We're convinced that if Florida wants to
14 compete in a highly technological world, it
15 must produce the educated work force that's
16 necessary for the recruitment, establishment,
17 expansion, and also the -- the retention of
18 such firms.
19 The 38.8 million dollars requested for
20 enrollment growth will fund an additional
21 3376 Full-Time Equivalent students. These
22 would be allocated among the universities with
23 consideration of their mission, their
24 demonstrated capacity to meet enrollment
25 targets, and also student demand within their
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1 service areas.
2 Now let me call to -- to your attention
3 a -- a different chart. This one shows our
4 Full-Time Equivalent enrollment history over
5 the past 15 years. As you can see, our FTE
6 enrollment of 87,000 in 1986 has increased by
7 about 59 percent, to almost 139 this past
8 academic year.
9 That number translates into about
10 220,000 head count students.
11 My point here is that our request for
12 3300 FTE is very consistent with the average
13 growth of 3400 each year over the course of the
14 past 15 years.
15 I would also just call to your attention
16 the fact that --
17 GOVERNOR BUSH: Adam, on -- just on that --
18 DR. HERBERT: Sure.
19 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- a couple of years ago, I
20 remember reading about the 80,000 -- hundred
21 and -- one -- one estimate was over 100,000
22 students would be in the next ten years, and
23 the next one was eighty. And 3,000 times ten's
24 thirty.
25 DR. HERBERT: Yeah.
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1 GOVERNOR BUSH: So what's the --
2 DR. HERBERT: What happened was that --
3 now, we went back through and took a very hard
4 look at the projections for graduation rates.
5 And one of the things that -- that resulted
6 was that we reduced our estimates within --
7 within the university system, both as to the
8 total number of students who are likely to
9 graduate with standard diplomas, as well as the
10 percentage that we would normally, or naturally
11 recruit into our system.
12 Now, the bottom line is that over time, we
13 will have to increase the -- the total FTE
14 requests that we're making.
15 But based upon where we are right now, we
16 think this is --
17 GOVERNOR BUSH: Is that because there's a
18 low percentage of the -- of the young -- the
19 students that come -- that graduate. If the --
20 if the graduation rate starts increasing, the
21 FTE numbers will grow?
22 DR. HERBERT: That's correct. That's
23 correct. And so we would come back and ask for
24 additional FTE, as we actually experience
25 that -- that level of growth.
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1 GOVERNOR BUSH: And we all hope you do.
2 DR. HERBERT: As -- as we all hope to do.
3 And, as a matter of fact, what we're doing
4 is establishing delivery platforms based upon
5 the assumption that all of the education
6 initiatives that are in place are going to
7 work.
8 And that's why our concurring use campuses
9 with the community colleges; our branch
10 campuses, centers, sites; distance learning,
11 all become a part of that comprehensive
12 strategy.
13 And since we're talking about branches and
14 centers, I would also just call to your
15 attention that we are requesting this year
16 additional monies. Last year the Legislature
17 appropriated 7.5 million dollars for us to
18 utilize in branch campuses.
19 We think it's very important to continue
20 to -- to focus attention in that area. We are
21 going to ask this year, not only for money for
22 our branch campuses and centers, but also for
23 authorization to use some of those dollars as
24 part of our partnerships with the community
25 colleges so that we can -- can offer more
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1 degree programs on site on the community
2 college campuses.
3 I would also just call to your attention
4 that we have included as a fourth item a
5 proposal for 89 million dollars related to
6 enhancement of our programs at the
7 undergraduate, graduate, professional
8 education, research, and extension service
9 activities.
10 Through these enhancement issues, the Board
11 of Regents requests that the universities again
12 this year be given the flexibility to set their
13 own priorities within the framework of the
14 State University System Strategic Plan in order
15 to achieve statewide goals.
16 The universities will submit specific plans
17 for the use of these funds. And included in
18 them will be very clear accountability
19 measures, along with accompanying base line
20 data and standards so that we can assess
21 whether or not each university has fulfilled
22 the commitments that have been outlined.
23 The fifth issue relates to research.
24 We are asking for 19.1 million for the
25 development and -- and also implementation of
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1 I-4, I-10, and I-95 research corridors in which
2 universities collaborate on projects.
3 Included in the request are funds necessary
4 to match the tax exemption earned by
5 Lucent Technologies along I-4 research
6 corridor, as well as expanding opportunities
7 for our universities along I-10 and I-95 to
8 work much more closely with the -- the -- the
9 private sector in fostering economic growth and
10 development along those corridors.
11 And I would just note that our recent
12 experiences along the I-4 research corridor
13 have been very significant. We now see about
14 4 billion dollars being pumped annually into
15 the economy supporting 41,000 jobs.
16 And we are convinced that if we can begin
17 to mobilize this state in a way that we have
18 not historically, with our universities working
19 in much closer partnership with oh, Ted OTED,
20 with Enterprise Florida, and with the private
21 sector, that we will have a major impact on
22 transforming the economic base of this state.
23 We have, as you know, a significant amount
24 of intellectual capital, advanced education
25 training capabilities, research products,
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1 processes being generated. And so these funds
2 will help us to continue these initiatives.
3 I would also just call to your attention as
4 we go about the business of helping to -- to
5 build this kind of -- of broad base of -- of
6 support for the private sector, we've also
7 established a research alliance that -- that
8 enables us to bring all of our universities
9 across the state together in pursuit of this
10 economic growth and development agenda.
11 The sixth and final issue is a 4.5 million
12 dollar request, and I -- I mention this in
13 particular in the context of what you have been
14 discussing today.
15 I think it's extremely relevant to -- to
16 the obvious concerns that all of you have
17 articulated.
18 We're asking for 4.5 million dollars for
19 the State University System to develop and
20 begin the implementation of strategies to
21 improve public education at all levels in this
22 state.
23 We would like to work with you, and our
24 partners across the state, in foraging stronger
25 relationships that will result in the
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1 significant enhancement of readiness
2 initiatives, as well as with our pre-K and
3 K through 12 initiatives.
4 What we're talking about, and this ties
5 back to a theme that the Governor has so
6 clearly and effectively expressed over the
7 course of the past several months. Our
8 commitment is to build a -- Florida into an
9 opportunity state.
10 And so what we're looking for in the
11 context of our missions is ways in which we can
12 expand professional development strategies;
13 develop new career ladders for teachers;
14 research networks that will help us to get at
15 some of the kinds of critical questions that
16 you were talking about a few moments ago,
17 utilizing user friendly evaluation assessment
18 tools to evaluate student learning; and also to
19 determine ways in which we can -- can help in
20 fostering more effective early childhood care
21 methods.
22 Quality education, from our perspective, is
23 a shared responsibility. We must work
24 collaboratively to overcome the fragmentation,
25 and to engage in consensus building, cutting
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1 across all sectors of our state.
2 And I am very proud of the fact that the
3 Florida Board of Regents feels very strongly
4 about the importance of all of our universities
5 being active participants in Florida's school
6 readiness program, and that we must be among
7 the -- the leaders in trying to make a
8 difference. Not trying to take it over, but
9 being a partner with those who regard this as
10 their core mission.
11 And I would also note that we are
12 attempting to develop a comprehensive strategy
13 for addressing the commitments that -- that we
14 feel are important. We want to do what we can
15 to -- to assure that the goals of A+ are
16 effectively implemented.
17 And in that regard, I would just tell you
18 that I've asked the Board of Regents to define
19 SUS activities in these areas as a
20 Chancellor-level initiative for which I'll be
21 held personally accountable.
22 And I would just like to conclude by
23 telling you this, that -- because I'm very
24 proud of what is taking place.
25 I have asked for the support and active
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1 involvement of the Regents, all SUS faculty and
2 administrators, and students in this effort.
3 And the -- the level of enthusiasm has been
4 very encouraging.
5 Three weeks ago, we held our first meeting
6 on this initiative in Orlando. I had more than
7 60 of our colleagues representing all of
8 Florida's public education community gathered
9 to -- to talk about ways that -- that we,
10 within the education establishment can make a
11 difference.
12 I had deans of all of our Colleges of
13 Education, every one of our Colleges of Arts
14 and Sciences, our Colleges of Health, and IFAS
15 that came together representing the SUS.
16 And the bottom line is, we're going to come
17 forward with a plan that we think can -- can
18 make a significant difference working with our
19 partners at all levels in transforming
20 education.
21 And -- and addressing the goals, Governor,
22 that you have articulated, as has the
23 Legislature.
24 That concludes my report, and I'd be happy
25 to respond to any questions.
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1 GOVERNOR BUSH: Any questions?
2 Chancellor, a real quick question.
3 Courtelis Grants. Any changes in policy
4 you foresee presenting to the Legislature this
5 year?
6 DR. HERBERT: We're going to have a meeting
7 with all of our presidents, our foundation
8 presidents, and our development offices within
9 the next two weeks.
10 We'll be looking at that issue, as well as
11 the -- the Challenge --
12 (Treasurer Nelson entered the room.)
13 DR. HERBERT: -- Grant Program.
14 And I do anticipate that we'll come forward
15 with some recommended changes. Definitely in
16 the -- the Matching Gifts Program, and
17 potentially in the Courtelis Program as well.
18 GOVERNOR BUSH: I thought they were the
19 same thing. They're --
20 DR. HERBERT: No.
21 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- they're different?
22 DR. HERBERT: They're two different
23 programs. The Courtelis Program relates to the
24 construction of facilities.
25 The Matching Gifts Program relates to -- to
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1 monies going into -- into the endowment. So
2 we're going to be looking at both of those, and
3 that will occur within the next two weeks.
4 GOVERNOR BUSH: Thank you.
5 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: I'd like to move
6 the university budget.
7 SECRETARY HARRIS: Second.
8 GOVERNOR BUSH: There's a motion and a
9 second.
10 All in favor?
11 THE CABINET: Aye.
12 GOVERNOR BUSH: I will withhold my vote,
13 and reserve the right to make separate
14 recommendations through the legislative
15 process.
16 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Governor, I'd like
17 General Milligan to note, there's been a recent
18 sighting of the Golden Potato.
19 It's been rumored to have moved to
20 California with a former spelling bee team
21 member, and we're working on getting it back
22 for you.
23 GOVERNOR BUSH: You're kidding.
24 Charlie Reed -- Chancellor Reed took it.
25 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Yeah, I know. But
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1 he may know where it is.
2 GOVERNOR BUSH: Item 4.
3 MR. PIERSON: Item 4 is Milburn Academy,
4 Incorporated, versus Hillsborough County School
5 Board. This was deferred from the August 12th
6 agenda.
7 The State Board of Education considers
8 appeals of denials of charter school
9 applications pursuant to 96-186, Laws of
10 Florida.
11 As prescribed by law, Florida school boards
12 are given authority to grant approval to
13 applicants who wish to operate charter schools
14 within a district.
15 Further provision of the law allows an
16 applicant who has been denied a charter the
17 right to appeal the School Board's decision to
18 the State Board of Education.
19 Based on the written record and oral
20 argument presented at this meeting, the
21 State Board must vote to recommend acceptance
22 or rejections of the appeal of the
23 School Board.
24 The vote requires a simple majority of the
25 members, and by law is not subject to the
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1 provisions of the Administrative Procedures
2 Act.
3 The rule governing the appeal process was
4 unanimously adopted by the Cabinet, sitting as
5 the State Board of Education, on December 10th,
6 1996.
7 It very clearly states how this hearing
8 must proceed, and it specifies the following
9 limitations which must be respected by the
10 applicant, the district School Board, and their
11 representatives.
12 The Notice of Appeal must be based on
13 errors the applicant charges the School Board
14 made on its decision to deny the charter. The
15 written argument submitted by the applicant to
16 the State Board is limited to discussion of
17 these errors.
18 The record of this proceeding is limited to
19 the written arguments, the charter school
20 application itself, and transcripts of meetings
21 before the district School Board.
22 At this hearing, representatives of each
23 party may give oral argument. Oral argument is
24 limited to a summary of the written arguments
25 previously submitted to the State Board. Each
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1 side has been asked to present their summary
2 within 10 minutes.
3 After the summaries are presented, a vote
4 will be taken and a written recommendation of
5 the vote will be returned to the district
6 School Board.
7 Representing the Milburn Academy, we have
8 Robert H. Crosby, President.
9 GOVERNOR BUSH: Welcome.
10 MR. CROSBY: Hi.
11 Governor Bush, Commissioner Gallagher,
12 Cabinet members.
13 I am here representing Richard Milburn
14 Academy. My name is Robert Crosby. I am the
15 President and Chief Executive of
16 Richard Milburn Academy, and also
17 Richard Milburn High School, Inc.
18 On February 1st, 1999, Richard Milburn
19 Academy submitted a timely application to
20 Hillsborough County.
21 Just in the background on this, I represent
22 a school -- a program that's 25 five years old.
23 I think we're probably the -- one of the
24 largest alternative schools for at-risk kids in
25 this country. Not a lot of people know about
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1 us, but we're serving about 3,000 at-risk
2 high school students in 20 locations around the
3 country.
4 Our track record is second to none. Over
5 85 percent of our kids stay in school or
6 graduate. We have three of our locations
7 accredited by the Southern Association of
8 Colleges and Schools.
9 So we're -- in our application, we're not
10 naive reformists, but very experienced
11 educators with a -- with a great track record.
12 (Commissioner Gallagher exited the room.)
13 MR. CROSBY: We met with -- on
14 February 23rd, we met with Hillsborough -- the
15 Hillsborough Charter Committee, made a brief
16 presentation, and we answered all the questions
17 and concerns presented at that meeting.
18 A week later, I -- I got a fax with
19 15 concerns that they wanted me to respond to.
20 Many of the concerns were never brought up at
21 the original meeting, which surprised me. I
22 had a little uneasy feeling at that time.
23 On March 11th, I got a letter from
24 Mrs. Pirko, who's the charter coordinator in
25 Hillsborough County, indicating that RMA was
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1 not recommended for five reasons.
2 This to say -- this decision was based, and
3 I quote: In part, on five reasons.
4 I had another slightly uneasy feeling when
5 they denied me, in part, on five reasons,
6 because, of course, the question I have to ask
7 is: What else is there? Is this a setup?
8 RMA -- Richard Milburn responded to these
9 five reasons, providing a detailed response,
10 positive response, for each reason.
11 (Commissioner Gallagher entered the room.)
12 MR. CROSBY: I'd like to note that out of
13 115 criteria on the application, we were turned
14 down on only five criteria.
15 On March 31st, we got the denial letter
16 from Mrs. Pirko, based on the March 30th Board
17 meeting.
18 RMA submitted a timely appeal of that
19 decision. The five stated objections for
20 denial were: One, Richard Milburn was a
21 Virginia nonprofit corporation -- a 501(c)(3),
22 if I may add.
23 Two, Richard Milburn's budget was unclear.
24 Three, corporate letters of reference on
25 Richard Milburn Academy were not included in
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1 the application.
2 Four, the majority of the governing board
3 were not from Hillsborough County.
4 Five, there were mixed levels of
5 satisfaction on verbal reference checks on
6 Richard Milburn Academy's administrative
7 services subcontractor.
8 On June 16th, at a Cabinet Aide's meeting,
9 we made this presentation. Following this
10 meeting, Richard Milburn Academy and
11 representatives from Hillsborough County agreed
12 on six changes to the application that were
13 necessary to -- to obtain a School Board
14 positive decision.
15 On June 18 -- 18th, I briefly wrote to
16 Mrs. Pirko of our agreements in writing.
17 On July 6th, I computed -- I communicated
18 in more detail to Dr. Donnie Evans, who's an
19 Assistant Superintendent in
20 Hillsborough County, confirming our
21 understanding.
22 And these changes were, one,
23 Richard Milburn will oper-- will -- will
24 incorporate in the State of Florida as a
25 domestic nonprofit corporation.
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1 This was done on July 9th, signed by
2 Katherine Harris, your -- your Secretary of
3 State.
4 So objection number one was removed.
5 The budget was clarified for allowing
6 $400 per student for transportation, $1,000 for
7 food services for students who do not qualify
8 for free lunch, a statement that any loans
9 provided would be at 0.75 percent above the
10 prime rate.
11 If I may add, Hillsborough County misread
12 our application, and thought that -- that we
13 were going to borrow money at 7.5 percent above
14 prime, where it clearly showed in the
15 application, it was 0.75. I guess they felt it
16 was so low, that I made a mistake.
17 And we added a $50,000 start-up grant into
18 our projected income.
19 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Can I --
20 MR. CROSBY: So the objection on the
21 budget --
22 Yes.
23 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Let me just
24 interrupt one quick second, if I could.
25 I think we may be able to short-circuit this a
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1 little bit, and save it.
2 If we could -- if you would just step back
3 a second and let us hear from the school
4 district, we may not need to hear all your
5 arguments.
6 MR. CROSBY: Okay. Thank you.
7 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: And we may be able
8 to get it -- cut it a little shorter.
9 GOVERNOR BUSH: Thank you, Commissioner.
10 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Thank you,
11 Governor.
12 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: You want to
13 go ahead and just give your --
14 GOVERNOR BUSH: Please. Go ahead.
15 DR. EVANS: Governor Bush, members of the
16 Cabinet. I'm Donnie Evans, Assistant
17 Superintendent for Instruction for the
18 Hillsborough County School system.
19 At this point in time, our School Board has
20 no concerns about the contents of the
21 application. Mr. Crosby and his group, as a
22 result of a Cabinet meeting earlier this year,
23 made changes in the application sufficient to
24 address our concerns.
25 Our Board's concern at this point though is
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1 the time line for reconsideration. We have
2 already undertaken the application process;
3 that is, receiving applications and reviewing
4 them during this year -- in fact, it began at
5 the beginning of this month, and will conclude
6 in February for consideration of schools to
7 open next fall.
8 We're being asked, as I understand it, to
9 consider deviating from our established
10 procedure, and consider granting them, or
11 awarding them a charter contract to begin
12 implementation in January.
13 And that's where the concern is at this
14 point, not with the contents of the
15 application.
16 GOVERNOR BUSH: Oh, beginning in January.
17 DR. EVANS: Pardon?
18 GOVERNOR BUSH: Beginning in January,
19 not --
20 DR. EVANS: That's correct.
21 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- in --
22 DR. EVANS: And -- and the -- and the
23 reason for our Board's concern is that during
24 the past three years, we've received roughly
25 25 applicants for -- or applications, rather,
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1 for charter. And we've approved eleven of
2 those. We have ten operating in the district
3 at this point in time.
4 And we've said to each of those applicants
5 that if -- if you have some concerns that --
6 that -- regarding our denial, and this is for
7 those that were denied, then you can address
8 those, we will work with you in addressing
9 those concerns, and resubmit during the next
10 application cycle. We said that to Mr. Crosby
11 as well.
12 The changes that were made in Mr. Crosby's
13 application came at the conclusion of last
14 year's application cycle.
15 And, in fact, they took place in June, and
16 we had charter schools that were in that last
17 cycle already beginning to implement.
18 But at this point, that's our Board
19 concern --
20 GOVERNOR BUSH: Is that --
21 DR. EVANS: -- rather --
22 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- is that going to happen
23 every time that you have any concerns with any
24 application, that the timing will always kick
25 in where you -- you -- they will miss the year
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1 that they have attempted to apply to, because
2 you --
3 DR. EVANS: It depends on --
4 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- your applica--
5 DR. EVANS: -- it depends on when the
6 changes are made. Every applic--
7 GOVERNOR BUSH: But they're notified -- the
8 way it sounded like, it sounded like he was
9 notified of -- of these things kind of at the
10 very end of the process.
11 DR. EVANS: No. He was --
12 GOVERNOR BUSH: Not accurate?
13 DR. EVANS: He was notified of our major
14 concerns prior to our Board considering the
15 application for approval or denial.
16 All of the applicants are notified, and
17 they're given the opportunity to make changes
18 in the application prior to our recommendation
19 ever going to the Board.
20 It was only after our Board made a
21 decision, and the appeal process began, that
22 changes were made in the application.
23 GOVERNOR BUSH: I see.
24 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Well, let me just
25 add one other thing though.
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1 The changes were made, and the Board
2 didn't -- didn't accept those changes. They
3 basically said, make a new application.
4 Is that true?
5 DR. EVANS: Well, the Board said -- and --
6 and are saying at this point, we wish not to
7 reconsider the application. They haven't
8 actually decided whether or not to accept or
9 reject.
10 They've -- they've at this point assumed
11 the position of not considering it, and will
12 take into consideration any decision that this
13 body makes, or any recommendation that this
14 body makes.
15 Then the Board will convene and consider
16 whether or not to look at a January start
17 versus an -- an August start for -- for 2000.
18 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Well, you -- you
19 sort of smoked it right on out, Governor. It's
20 pretty clear that they could have made it
21 easier for this school to get up and get
22 started, because this issue first came to us at
23 the end of last school year.
24 But it looks to me -- and it's pretty
25 evident that, you know, roadblocks were put in
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1 to keep it from -- keep this school from
2 starting this -- in this beginning school year.
3 Now, the question that we need to look at
4 is: Should we remand it back to the --
5 Hillsborough County for approval in January, or
6 should we do it -- which is the County rules
7 that they operate by, and pretty much the way
8 we've tried to operate by -- and have it start
9 next school year.
10 There's two sides to it. One is that it's
11 pretty tough to get them -- to get a school
12 started from scratch for January, and also to
13 recruit students, and to do all those kinds of
14 things.
15 And it does interrupt students' year. Or
16 do we re-- remand it back, which is what I'm
17 prepared to do -- to recommend anyway -- and
18 have it -- have them vote to -- to open it up
19 for the next school year.
20 And I -- I guess we should hear from the --
21 the school prior to us being ready to make that
22 kind of a decision.
23 GOVERNOR BUSH: Commissioner, can you
24 explain to us what the limits are of our
25 capacity as the Board of Education on this?
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1 Are we --
2 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Yes.
3 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- by either one of those
4 alternatives, we can -- we -- we have the --
5 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: We recommend --
6 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- either one of those?
7 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: We recommend only
8 back to the -- the Board. The Board is
9 responsible to contract with the charter
10 schools, and to set the criteria by which they
11 allow them and measure their successfulness --
12 GOVERNOR BUSH: Okay.
13 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: -- by contract.
14 So we're here as a -- as a recommending
15 body.
16 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Governor --
17 GOVERNOR BUSH: Yes.
18 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: -- I'd like
19 to just to continue some comments of
20 Commissioner Gallagher.
21 I -- I agree with his assessment, his
22 analysis. And also I think we should -- we
23 should take into consideration that
24 Hillsborough has beyond a doubt the best track
25 record when it comes to authorizing and
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1 approving charter schools in the state.
2 And I think we should take that into
3 consideration and what the School Board's
4 desire is in our -- in our recomm-- our
5 recommendation.
6 GOVERNOR BUSH: Okay.
7 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: I have -- just
8 real quickly want to tell you that the -- the
9 law says, and I'll quote, the State Board shall
10 remand the application to the district
11 School Board with its written recommendation
12 that the School Board approve or deny the
13 application, consistent with the State Board's
14 decision.
15 I will say also that the State -- the
16 County School District -- the initial start-up
17 must be consistent with the beginning of the
18 public school calendar for the district in
19 which the charter is granted, unless the
20 district Board allows a waiver of this
21 provision for good cause.
22 That's out of statute. So --
23 GOVERNOR BUSH: But they're not --
24 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: They -- they would
25 have to waive it. We would have to recommend
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1 that.
2 Now, I've got to add one other thing.
3 Letter from the attorneys for the School Board.
4 I gather that's who -- Few and -- IAR --
5 MR. CROSBY: Crosby Few, yes.
6 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Right.
7 Crosby Few.
8 They do put at the end of their letter that
9 on -- or in the alternative, the School Board
10 of Educ-- the State Board of Education can give
11 our School Board direction as to what they
12 would like us to do, and our School Board will
13 be happy to follow that direction.
14 I'm not sure exactly what that means.
15 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: That sounds
16 like a lawyer, doesn't it, Governor?
17 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: But -- so we're --
18 you know, that -- I just added that to stir the
19 pot.
20 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Thank God
21 for lawyers here.
22 GOVERNOR BUSH: The big question is: Are
23 you taking a 5 percent paycut if there's an F
24 rated school?
25 DR. EVANS: Yes.
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1 GOVERNOR BUSH: You're not going to do it.
2 I know you guys won't.
3 DR. EVANS: No.
4 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- have that --
5 DR. EVANS: We won't have an F school.
6 GOVERNOR BUSH: I just -- I wanted to --
7 DR. EVANS: I assure you --
8 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- I want to commend
9 Superintendent Lennard and you and every person
10 in your School Board.
11 I know we're not supposed to be talking
12 about something off subject.
13 But I am so proud of what you've done. And
14 the impact of that, by the way, of getting
15 people mobilized to help in your own community,
16 but across the state, has been pretty profound.
17 There's been a very positive unintended
18 consequence. So I applaud you.
19 It's another good sign effort of
20 commitment, I think.
21 DR. EVANS: Thank you.
22 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: If we could hear
23 from Milburn Academy again on the issue, if you
24 would, of January/September.
25 MR. CROSBY: As you know, we started this
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1 process last February, anticipating that a
2 decision would be made in -- in March or April,
3 and we would begin in September. But the
4 process has dragged on through the summer.
5 And we are prepared, if required, to open
6 up in January. However, we would feel more
7 comfortable going to September.
8 GOVERNOR BUSH: Okay.
9 MR. CROSBY: What I'm after here --
10 GOVERNOR BUSH: Why --
11 MR. CROSBY: -- is a positive decision for
12 our school.
13 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: In that case --
14 GOVERNOR BUSH: Fine.
15 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: -- jump out the
16 window.
17 Governor, I make a motion, reject the
18 decision of Hillsborough County School Board,
19 and remand the application --
20 GOVERNOR BUSH: Is there a second?
21 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: -- to
22 Hillsborough County for approval.
23 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Second.
24 GOVERNOR BUSH: Moved and seconded.
25 Without objection, it's approved.
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1 I don't know why we even spent any time on
2 this. If -- if you were here to talk about
3 coming in September, we're -- we're grateful.
4 And I would suggest maybe that Hillsborough
5 look at pushing back its process a bit so that
6 there's a greater appeal process to work out
7 any details that you might want to have your --
8 your applicants go through so they could start
9 during a -- a typical school year.
10 But I -- again, thank you for coming.
11 May have saved the airfare on that one.
12 Item 5.
13 MR. PIERSON: Item 5 is a revised rule
14 6C-8.009(1), Definition and Process for
15 Establishing Educational Sites.
16 The presentation by Dr. Proctor.
17 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: This is the rule
18 that we sent back to the Board of Regents that
19 has now been set so that the Board of Regents
20 may set the guidelines in what campuses will
21 have the lower two freshman-sophomore year.
22 And it is -- it now -- went to the
23 Cabinet Aides, and everybody got together, and
24 set it so that any person that would like to
25 come to a Cabinet member, we are there to --
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1 over a 30-day period after that rule passes,
2 may bring it to us for discussion, and quite
3 possibly rejection if we see that it should be
4 for a valid reason.
5 And Dr. Proctor wants to discuss that a
6 little.
7 DR. PROCTOR: Governor Bush, members of the
8 Cabinet, I'm -- I'm still William Proctor, I'm
9 just speaking to you in another capacity.
10 On behalf of the Independent Colleges and
11 Universities of Florida, I've been asked to
12 make a few comments relative to the proposed
13 rule.
14 I would want you to understand that I am
15 not opposing the rule, nor are the Independent
16 Colleges and Universities of Florida opposing
17 the rule.
18 But we do think there's some clarifications
19 that would be quite helpful in the event that
20 the small independent college, or for that
21 matter, a large one, should want to oppose the
22 expansion into its area of a lower division.
23 Specifically, these clarifications are as
24 follows: It's stated that the Board of Regents
25 may approve lower divisions at any branch
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1 campus, center, or site.
2 I think we understand what a branch campus
3 is. But we're not clear on what a site may be.
4 Would that imply that there should be a --
5 a program in operation? Or a site could be
6 designated where there was no existing program?
7 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: If -- if you would
8 like -- as you go through, there's certain
9 people that can answer these questions.
10 GOVERNOR BUSH: Yeah.
11 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: And if -- and if
12 we go through them real quick and let them just
13 pop through with the answer to that, that'll
14 take care of your problem. And --
15 GOVERNOR BUSH: Chancellor, do you want to
16 have a --
17 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Board of Regents
18 will handle that for us?
19 DR. PROCTOR: Certainly.
20 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: We'll do them one
21 at a time, and just zip through them as fast as
22 we can.
23 DR. PROCTOR: Right.
24 MS. BESTEBREURTJE: I'm
25 Mary-Ann Bestebreurtje. I'm the Board's
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1 corporate secretary and associate counsel, and
2 I've been working with all of your Aides and
3 everybody on this rule.
4 I think branch campus centers and sites are
5 adequately defined elsewhere by our rules, and
6 in law.
7 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Well, why don't
8 you tell us what those are.
9 MS. BESTEBREURTJE: Now I need -- now I
10 need the Provost to answer that.
11 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Well, I think --
12 we're here on the record, and I think the
13 question deserves an answer other than it's
14 already in the rules.
15 MS. BESTEBREURTJE: No, no -- I understand
16 that.
17 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: In layman's
18 language.
19 GOVERNOR BUSH: The Chancellor's going to
20 step up.
21 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: There we go. He
22 knows what they are.
23 GOVERNOR BUSH: Clean-up hitter.
24 DR. HERBERT: We have some facilities that
25 are clearly defined as branch campuses, we --
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1 we have some places that are located in areas
2 that are not as large as a branch campus.
3 A branch campus is normally defined in the
4 context of a certain number of students. And
5 so essentially what we're -- we're -- and my
6 guess is that the -- the practical reality is
7 that the -- that most of -- of these programs
8 would occur on a formal branch campus.
9 But we recognize that as we attempt to
10 respond to needs of the state, that there may
11 be a -- a location which would not have enough
12 students to constitute a formal branch campus
13 with a -- a large library, with a -- a student
14 body of five or six thousand students. And so
15 it's really a size definition more than
16 anything else.
17 And those are spelled out in our rules. A
18 branch campus -- I've forgotten the exact
19 number, but it's somewhere in the neighborhood
20 of three to four thousand students that we
21 anticipate.
22 And the sites and centers would simply be
23 smaller locations, with size being the -- the
24 factor that distinguishes between them.
25 SECRETARY HARRIS: Governor --
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1 GOVERNOR BUSH: Yeah.
2 SECRETARY HARRIS: -- since we're looking
3 at a major policy shift, did you still feel it
4 was -- it was crucial to include center and
5 site?
6 Wouldn't it -- since we're making such a
7 broad shift, wouldn't it be better just to stay
8 with branch and -- where it's fully defined
9 where you have the facility, since it was one
10 of the not -- not standards or regulations that
11 was in the rule, but it was one of the
12 concepts.
13 DR. HERBERT: Well, they -- the -- the
14 bottom line here is that we're trying to figure
15 out how we can be most responsive to the needs
16 of the citizens of Florida. And -- and that
17 there may be some sites that over time would
18 evolve into branches as they grow.
19 And so --
20 SECRETARY HARRIS: Well, then the branch
21 would define that. The branch definition
22 would --
23 DR. HERBERT: Yeah.
24 SECRETARY HARRIS: -- define that.
25 DR. HERBERT: Well, the key issue here
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1 I think is that ultimately if there is an issue
2 or a concern, whether it is a branch, center,
3 or a site, those matters would come to -- to
4 you, and you would have an opportunity of
5 assessing the issue at that point, we would
6 have an obligation to lay out very clearly our
7 rationale for it.
8 And we would certainly do that as a routine
9 matter in any event, as we go through our
10 normal consultative processes.
11 SECRETARY HARRIS: Do you happen to know
12 the definition for center or site? I -- just
13 so that -- since we're trying to clarify and
14 get this answered for Dr. Proctor?
15 DR. HERBERT: I --
16 SECRETARY HARRIS: Does anyone know the --
17 GOVERNOR BUSH: I think that the --
18 SECRETARY HARRIS: -- definition?
19 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- the Chancellor is
20 stalling while the legal counsel finds the --
21 or --
22 SECRETARY HARRIS: Thanks.
23 GOVERNOR BUSH: Doing the rope-a-dope.
24 SECRETARY HARRIS: Sorry. Not an
25 ice dance.
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1 MS. BESTEBREURTJE: Okay. The center is
2 defined as an instructional unit of the
3 university or universities that offer a limited
4 range of instructional programs. Funded
5 enrollment at a center will be fewer than
6 300 FTE.
7 A site is defined as an instructional unit
8 that offers a very limited range of
9 instructional programs or courses, generally of
10 short duration of facilities not owned by the
11 institution.
12 GOVERNOR BUSH: It's leased?
13 DR. HERBERT: Or it could be in
14 collaboration with another institution,
15 for example. But it's not owned by the
16 State of Florida.
17 So, again, it's a combination of size
18 and -- and with regard to sites, it would not
19 be one of our facilities.
20 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Okay. Can we --
21 that's pretty well answered that.
22 Let's move to the next one.
23 Dr. Proctor.
24 DR. PROCTOR: Thank you.
25 Second point of clarification is stated
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1 that there will be discussions for those
2 educational institutions that may be effected.
3 Our concern is: Will those discussions
4 result in any type of -- of formal report which
5 would deal, of course, with the critical issue
6 of need and whether or not existing
7 institutions might meet that need?
8 There is no discussion of the discussion,
9 what would be the particulars of it, and
10 whether there would be a report emanating from
11 that discussion that PEPC and the State Board
12 might -- might review.
13 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: I think there --
14 we can hear from Dr. Herbert first on what he
15 considers discussions to be, and then PEPC can
16 answer how they perceive those discussions.
17 DR. HERBERT: Discussions would occur at
18 two levels. First, the -- the SUS institution
19 would communicate with the -- the
20 community colleges in the immediate area, and
21 also with any of the universities -- the
22 private or independent institutions that are
23 chartered in Florida.
24 Those conversations have occurred just
25 to -- to illustrate in the context of
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1 St. Petersburg. And we would assume that that
2 would automatically be the case in any future
3 instance should they -- that they arise.
4 Second, the -- the next level of discussion
5 would occur at the Board of Regents' level.
6 And it would be the responsibility of the
7 university to document when those conversations
8 occurred, and how that the -- that the
9 university has chosen to respond to them.
10 My staff will do the follow-up background
11 checks to -- to assure that, indeed, that the
12 characterization of those conversations is
13 accurate. And from that point -- and that
14 presentation would occur at a Board of Regents
15 meeting.
16 I think the second part of it relates to
17 PEPC, and Dr. Proctor can respond to that.
18 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: We have two
19 Dr. Proctors.
20 SECRETARY HARRIS: Yeah. Maybe we should
21 say President and Doctor, and distinguish.
22 DR. BILL PROCTOR: What we did in the
23 St. Pete instance, so you know, it was in their
24 report that they had consulted with two
25 institutions. We followed up.
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1 I had at least two conversations with the
2 presidents of each of those institutions to get
3 their thoughts on it. We incorporated that
4 into our recommendation that we took to our
5 Commission.
6 So in addition to the institution talking
7 with the affected community college and
8 independent institution, we also did the same.
9 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Doct--
10 DR. BILL PROCTOR: And will do the same in
11 the future.
12 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: While you're
13 there, will your review be comprehensive, and
14 will -- will it always have a definitive report
15 as you had here?
16 DR. BILL PROCTOR: Okay. What -- what we
17 will do is we will get the request that goes to
18 the Regents; we will review it; and in this --
19 this case, and in all future cases, we sent a
20 list of questions, both to the institution and
21 to the Board of Regents office to have those
22 questions answered. We got into numbers of
23 FTICs and all of those.
24 So I view it as it was a comprehensive
25 review. We did not publish a report just to
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1 publish a report. The questions were on
2 record, the responses were on record, our
3 recommendation to the Commission was on record,
4 it was adopted at a public meeting, and so we
5 will follow that same process every time.
6 SECRETARY HARRIS: Dr. Proctor, if I may.
7 This was the -- the report that we
8 received. This is all the Cabinet staff
9 received. And I'm -- I'm not disagreeing with
10 the process.
11 I was kind of looking for boxes of how it
12 would work with the State University System,
13 talking to the institutions, and maybe
14 simultaneously with PEPC, and the interaction
15 among them before it goes to the
16 Board of Regents.
17 My only concern was -- I didn't understand
18 initially when this came forward why we just
19 didn't add this as a third exception. My
20 biggest concern is the two plus two.
21 DR. BILL PROCTOR: Uh-hum.
22 SECRETARY HARRIS: But I -- I think for us
23 to make a decision, if there's ever an
24 objection, and -- and my -- the positive aspect
25 that I saw from the onset was that PEPC was
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1 going to be involved --
2 DR. BILL PROCTOR: Right.
3 SECRETARY HARRIS: -- and we would get an
4 analysis or report. But this is -- this is all
5 we received. So we cou--
6 DR. BILL PROCTOR: I -- I don't have --
7 SECRETARY HARRIS: -- this was --
8 DR. BILL PROCTOR: -- I don't have a copy
9 of --
10 SECRETARY HARRIS: -- the letter from
11 you -- from -- I'm sorry, from Phillip Margaman
12 that just says that you're in support of this
13 decision. So if there's --
14 DR. BILL PROCTOR: Okay.
15 SECRETARY HARRIS: -- an analysis that
16 there are objections from the --
17 DR. BILL PROCTOR: We can --
18 SECRETARY HARRIS: -- community colleges --
19 (Treasurer Nelson exited the room.)
20 DR. BILL PROCTOR: -- we can send you what
21 we send our Commission. I believe it's posted
22 on our web page.
23 SECRETARY HARRIS: It -- it would just
24 probably be helpful to have --
25 DR. BILL PROCTOR: Right.
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1 SECRETARY HARRIS: -- that kind of input.
2 Because in the future, if -- if we're ever
3 going to air this at the Cabinet meetings, and
4 it becomes very political, and its all these
5 kinds of things, we -- we want PEPC's
6 objective --
7 DR. BILL PROCTOR: Sure.
8 SECRETARY HARRIS: -- analysis.
9 DR. BILL PROCTOR: We can certainly give
10 you the backup and the correspondence that went
11 back and forth, and the discussion, and all of
12 that. There's a lot more paper than what you
13 have in front of you.
14 SECRETARY HARRIS: Thank you.
15 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: I think the real
16 issue is if they find -- found fault in it, we
17 would have a lot of discussion and materials.
18 And they did not find fault in it.
19 And pretty much everybody's bought into
20 this. So, therefore --
21 SECRETARY HARRIS: Then that -- then that's
22 fine. As long as -- as long as we have that
23 type of --
24 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Now, we're --
25 SECRETARY HARRIS: -- analysis.
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1 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: -- again, we're --
2 we're separating issues here because we're --
3 he's talking a lot about -- in this -- what
4 he's sent to us is on the rule, and also right
5 behind that, the decision was made by the
6 Board of Regents to approve the St. Pete
7 campus.
8 GOVERNOR BUSH: Onward.
9 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: I'm trying to get
10 through this as fast as -- as possible.
11 Go ahead, Dr. Proctor.
12 DR. PROCTOR: Move right along.
13 You answered our second one by the --
14 Mr. Commissioner, by clarifying the nature of
15 the PEPC report. And that's certainly
16 satisfactory.
17 The next one applies to the appeal process
18 itself. We understand it would have to be
19 initiated by a member of the Board.
20 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: I think we need to
21 call this an -- a final approval process. It's
22 not really an appeal process.
23 DR. PROCTOR: All right, sir.
24 And the question we would raise is whether
25 30 days would be adequate time to review the
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1 PEPC report, assuming that that would be
2 forthcoming sometime after the action of the
3 Board of Regents.
4 And we'd ask you to -- to look at that
5 30 days as whether or not it's -- it's an
6 adequate period of time for that review.
7 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: The -- the 30 days
8 does not have to have a -- a PEPC review. The
9 30 days if -- and it's my belief, as long as
10 I'm here, and I would guess that the other
11 Cabinet members would feel the same way.
12 If the Board of Regents would approve a
13 branch campus for lower division, and a
14 citizen, an affected school, or pretty much
15 anybody else, would want us as the State Board
16 to look at that and to review it, I would be
17 certainly willing to -- to hold it until it's
18 reviewed for final approval.
19 DR. PROCTOR: Okay.
20 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Short of no one
21 having a complaint, basically because the
22 university system has done their homework and
23 done a good job of getting it checked out with
24 everyone, there would be no need to do that,
25 and it could go on ahead.
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1 DR. PROCTOR: Very good.
2 SECRETARY HARRIS: Seems like the simple
3 flow chart would suffice. But 30 days -- I
4 know the -- I read the transcript that
5 General Butterworth asked about when we're gone
6 for 30 days, it could end up being six weeks.
7 I mean, so there's -- even though the rule
8 says 30 days, that's not a written in stone
9 30 days. There'll be opportunity if -- if
10 there's some concern?
11 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: The -- the -- the
12 issue is that if one of the Cabinet members
13 would, within 30 days, want to put it on the
14 agenda, that approval is withheld until it's
15 agendaed and heard.
16 SECRETARY HARRIS: Okay.
17 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: But you only get
18 30 days to put that request in for it to be
19 heard.
20 DR. PROCTOR: Very good.
21 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Does everybody
22 agree with that?
23 Everybody is nodding, the Chancellor and
24 everybody else are nodding yes.
25 DR. BILL PROCTOR: Yes.
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1 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Okay.
2 DR. PROCTOR: The second -- or the last
3 point of clarification, sir, is the question
4 of -- and several presidents have raised
5 this -- this issue.
6 What would be the nature of the evidence
7 that an affected institution, or one that
8 perceives itself to be, might present in this
9 review?
10 We would presume that there would have to
11 be some evidence on our part that the
12 institution would be damaged, or that there
13 might be a more economical way to accomplish
14 this objective within the resources that are in
15 this area.
16 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Doc--
17 DR. PROCTOR: If there's anything else that
18 would be a part of that, it would be helpful.
19 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: I will tell you
20 from my point of view, and I -- each of us
21 would have to have their own point of view.
22 It is a decision that we could make for any
23 reason that we felt we should vote in any way.
24 In other words, if, in fact, notwithstanding
25 everybody's complaint, we think it's a good
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1 idea, we can vote that way.
2 If notwithstanding the Board of Regents'
3 feelings on how important it is, we could vote
4 against it.
5 I think it depends on the Cabinet members'
6 feeling in regards to the evidence brought --
7 brought forward on whether they would want to
8 put the final approval on it, or not have that
9 final approval take place. So, therefore, they
10 would not be able to open that campus.
11 I don't think that we should restrict that
12 decision making process in any manner
13 whatsoever. That is the individual conscience
14 of the individual State Board members.
15 DR. PROCTOR: Very good, sir.
16 SECRETARY HARRIS: Commissioner --
17 DR. PROCTOR: Yes, ma'am.
18 SECRETARY HARRIS: -- if I may. I know
19 we're kind of on a time crunch.
20 But I guess my concerns -- I understand
21 we're still just dealing with the rule, and I
22 approve of the 30-day rules.
23 But, Commissioner Gallagher, if I -- if I
24 can just talk to you about this for a moment,
25 because we have to do this in the sunshine.
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1 My concern is still the two plus two. We
2 have an extraordinary system, and -- and we're
3 really changing how we're going to do business
4 in the -- in the future.
5 From the standpoint, well, before -- this
6 couldn't occur, and now it's going to happen at
7 a Cabinet level, and we're going to have the
8 PEPC input, so that's good.
9 But the two plus twos, it's -- when I sat
10 on the Senate Higher Education Committee, it
11 was always hammered in that this was the
12 fundamental policy of postsecondary education.
13 And without -- without standards, we have some
14 conceptual issues in the rule.
15 But there are no standards. It's -- it's
16 just -- it's totally discretionary, and they're
17 vague. You know, we can have a discussion with
18 the community colleges, or ICUF just basically
19 by saying, you're not -- you don't -- it's bad
20 for you.
21 Well, that's okay.
22 And then it comes to the Cabinet.
23 I mean, there's no real discussion, even
24 for the number of students -- the student
25 demand. If there's not a student demand,
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1 you've had that discussion.
2 So it's not a standard that you're trying
3 to achieve that there's a significant student
4 demand.
5 I guess my concern is just watching the
6 politics of how the thousands of letters came
7 in, and -- and the very, you know, significant
8 people in St. Petersburg, this is -- this is
9 going to be a great scenario in St. Petersburg.
10 But I don't think the situation's going to
11 differ at any branch location where the
12 university wants to expand. You're going to
13 still have that strong community support.
14 And -- and I just think we have to look at
15 where we're going with the State -- this may be
16 the best delivery of services.
17 My concern is still at the university
18 system, it was -- it's more expensive than at
19 the community colleges, and there was
20 accessibility. So there was, you know, sort of
21 a good balance.
22 And I understand the turf issues about
23 community colleges wanting to offer four-year
24 programs, and universities wanting to come in
25 and kind of countermand that.
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1 I just hope that we're making all these
2 decisions not in an isolated fashion. And I
3 know you, more than anyone,
4 Commissioner Gallagher, are aware of this. I'm
5 just concerned where we're going with two plus
6 two, and -- and as we continue to tweak this,
7 if -- and these branch campuses become
8 four-year universities where -- where we're
9 going fiscally and where we're going
10 educationally.
11 That's my only concern.
12 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Even though this
13 rule change stirred up a lot more than I think
14 the members of the Board of Regents and the
15 Chancellor thought it was going to -- it didn't
16 stir up more than I thought it was going to,
17 but more than they thought -- I will tell you
18 that the Chancellor and the Executive Director
19 of the Community Colleges have probably never
20 worked closer in the history of the university
21 system, and the community college system, in
22 having joint programs and working together on
23 two plus two.
24 The community colleges will be coming
25 forward with a rule in regards to extending the
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September 28, 1999
1 community colleges into the university level.
2 And so I think they're working very, very
3 close together. Probably as -- as close or
4 better than any other time.
5 But there are things like this that make it
6 easier for the Board of Regents to do certain
7 things, and there's going to be some things
8 that community colleges are going to come
9 forward and want to do. And we're going to
10 have to sort of balance those.
11 This particular campus in St. Petersburg is
12 an important thing to that community. There is
13 no reason why normal admit students who would
14 have to drive 40 miles each way to go to school
15 should have to do that in St. Petersburg where
16 they do not have their own university.
17 And it's a -- and it's a --
18 GOVERNOR BUSH: Yeah.
19 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: -- the largest
20 urban area that doesn't. And so this makes all
21 the sense in the world.
22 And I think we should look at each one of
23 those. And anybody that would like us to look
24 at it, they get 30 days to get us to say yes,
25 and we will. Otherwise, let the -- let it move
ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.
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September 28, 1999
1 on.
2 DR. BILL PROCTOR: And that was a
3 consideration in our review, the two plus two,
4 in addition to the affected institutions, and
5 all of that.
6 SECRETARY HARRIS: Thank you.
7 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: I'd like to move
8 the rule.
9 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Second.
10 GOVERNOR BUSH: There --
11 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: I'm sorry.
12 MR. PIERSON: Senator Sebesta has asked to
13 speak on the rule.
14 GOVERNOR BUSH: Please, Senator.
15 You're going to miss your flight if you
16 don't watch it, pal.
17 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Yeah. That's
18 right. We'll cut you off on your trip.
19 SENATOR SEBESTA: Et tu Brute.
20 Governor and Board members, I'll be brief.
21 I told you 30 seconds.
22 I just want to thank you all for -- on
23 behalf of the residents of St. Petersburg; and
24 the almost million residents in
25 Pinellas County; and more specifically, the
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September 28, 1999
1 5,000 graduating high school seniors every year
2 who will, because of your action and the Board
3 of Regents and PEPC and the others, will have
4 the opportunity for a full four-year university
5 education right in their backyard.
6 They've never had this opportunity, and we
7 thank you all very, very much.
8 Twenty-seven seconds, Governor.
9 GOVERNOR BUSH: Thank you.
10 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: That's sort of on
11 the next issue, but it does have a little bit
12 to do with this.
13 I'd like to move the rule.
14 GOVERNOR BUSH: There's a motion.
15 Is there a second?
16 Moved and seconded.
17 Without objection, it is approved.
18 We're almost there, Chancellor. You get to
19 go back one more time to the Board of Regents,
20 and --
21 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: I'd also like to
22 mention that the Board of Regents has sent --
23 (Applause.)
24 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: No. You want
25 to -- you want to applaud at the next one.
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1 GOVERNOR BUSH: Yeah.
2 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: I'd like to
3 mention that the Board of Regents has sent
4 forward to us the approval -- they have voted
5 to approve the --
6 GOVERNOR BUSH: That --
7 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: -- St. Petersburg
8 campus.
9 And because we have previously approved
10 that, I'd like to ask if no one has a problem
11 with that, that we agree to waive the 30 days
12 and let that campus move on and be legal,
13 et cetera.
14 And I'd like to make that motion.
15 SECRETARY HARRIS: Second.
16 GOVERNOR BUSH: There's a motion to waive
17 the rule of the 30-day notice, and there's a
18 second.
19 Without objection, it's approved.
20 Now you can applaud.
21 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Now you can
22 applaud.
23 (Applause.)
24 GOVERNOR BUSH: Geez.
25 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Now we have some
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1 very happy pers-- people, especially
2 President Castor, who promised she was going to
3 get this campus before she left. And she's
4 leaving in two days, right?
5 So it is now done.
6 SENATOR SEBESTA: Wonderful. Thank you.
7 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Congratulations.
8 Governor --
9 GOVERNOR BUSH: Thank you.
10 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: -- at the end of
11 this budget, I'd like to -- to announce
12 something that I'm really pleased with, and
13 it's part of your A+ plan.
14 I'd like to let all of us here on the
15 State Board of Education know that 323 of our
16 schools will be receiving today checks, and
17 actually some of it's being wire transferred as
18 we speak, ranging from $6,700 to $316,000 as
19 recipients of the 1999 school recognition
20 awards.
21 And I know each of you all join me in
22 recognizing and congratulating those schools
23 for their extraordinary efforts.
24 I'm extremely proud of the -- let me just
25 pass these down so you can see what we're
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September 28, 1999
1 releasing today.
2 I'm extremely proud of the students and the
3 staff at each one of these schools. With even
4 higher standards in place, we have more than
5 twice the number of schools being recognized
6 this year for substantial -- substained (sic)
7 high performance and significant improvement.
8 Last year we had only 140 schools.
9 When we expect more, Governor, I think than
10 what the A+ plan says that you pushed, we get
11 more.
12 As you know, the Legislature appropriated
13 15 million dollars for schools to receive up to
14 $100 a student. And we exhausted that money in
15 record time.
16 Actually due to the number of schools that
17 qualified for this award, I was very concerned
18 that we would not be able to give them the full
19 $100.
20 But we requested an additional 15 million
21 dollars budget amendment to you, Governor; you
22 approved it; sent it on to the legislative
23 leaders, they approved it.
24 And here's the breakdown. There are
25 122 improved schools; 95 A schools; 106 A and
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September 28, 1999
1 improved schools, which means, they're A, plus
2 improved.
3 Immediately following the Cabinet,
4 Governor, you and I are going to go present the
5 actual warrant to Griffin Middle School here in
6 Tallahassee, with a check for $73,504.
7 And then we will head to
8 Hillsborough County where we will present the
9 check for $110,596 to McLane Middle School.
10 The students and faculty of these schools
11 should be proud of their hard work, because I
12 know we certainly are. And we expect to even
13 see higher number -- a higher number of schools
14 next year lining up to receive similar awards.
15 So at times when we hear of -- that people
16 are upset about the way the schools are graded
17 and they're getting to let those objections, or
18 any -- hopefully, corrective criticism that
19 they'd like at the five meetings that are
20 taking place across this state, at the same
21 time, those schools that have done a wonderful
22 job showing improvement, those schools that
23 have managed to be A schools, are receiving
24 their $100 per student.
25 And I want to just point out, we have
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September 28, 1999
1 schools, for example, in Hillsborough,
2 Cleveland Elementary. They have 96 percent
3 free and reduced lunch. They're a C school.
4 They're receiving $43,156.
5 So we have some schools that historically
6 educators would say, they're from a low poverty
7 area, there's a good excuse why they're not
8 performing.
9 And the truth of the matter is, with
10 fantastic leadership from the principals of
11 these schools, and wonderful teachers, some of
12 these students have made their schools earn
13 this award, and we're thrilled with it.
14 And so I'm happy to report that to you,
15 Governor.
16 GOVERNOR BUSH: And this money goes to the
17 principals, teachers, and parents, it doesn't
18 go to anybody else. It's a direct check. It's
19 in the mail, or it's being wire transferred.
20 It's in their bank account --
21 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Today they will
22 all have it.
23 GOVERNOR BUSH: To do whatever they see
24 fit. Back to the notion of tr-- who we trust,
25 do we trust --
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1 (Secretary Harris exited the room.)
2 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- the State Board of
3 Education, or even our very able
4 Education Commissioner to create education
5 policy, or do we trust principals and teachers
6 and parents to do it.
7 I vote -- notwithstanding my love of
8 Tom Gallagher, I vote for the parents,
9 teachers, and principals, and they're going to
10 be --
11 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Me, too.
12 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- able to do this now.
13 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Me, too.
14 Well, thank you for letting me do that.
15 GOVERNOR BUSH: That's great.
16 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: And now we're done
17 with --
18 GOVERNOR BUSH: That's it.
19 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: -- education by --
20 for this meeting anyway. Took a while.
21 GOVERNOR BUSH: That did take a while.
22 (The State Board of Education Agenda was
23 concluded.)
24 *
25
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144
September 28, 1999
1 CERTIFICATE OF REPORTER
2
3
4
5 STATE OF FLORIDA:
6 COUNTY OF LEON:
7 I, LAURIE L. GILBERT, do hereby certify that
8 the foregoing proceedings were taken before me at the
9 time and place therein designated; that my shorthand
10 notes were thereafter translated; and the foregoing
11 pages numbered 1 through 144 are a true and correct
12 record of the aforesaid proceedings.
13 I FURTHER CERTIFY that I am not a relative,
14 employee, attorney or counsel of any of the parties,
15 nor relative or employee of such attorney or counsel,
16 or financially interested in the foregoing action.
17 DATED THIS 7TH day of OCTOBER, 1999.
18
19
20 LAURIE L. GILBERT, RPR, CCR, CRR, RMR
100 Salem Court
21 Tallahassee, Florida 32301
850/878-2221
22
23
24
25
ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.
T H E C A B I N E T
S T A T E O F F L O R I D A
Representing:
YEAR 2000 CABINET SCHEDULE
STATE BOARD OF EDUCATION
BOARD OF TRUSTEES OF THE
INTERNAL IMPROVEMENT TRUST FUND
SOUTH FLORIDA WATER MANAGEMENT DISTRICT
FINANCIAL MANAGEMENT INFORMATION BOARD
ADMINISTRATION COMMISSION
FLORIDA LAND AND WATER ADJUDICATORY COMMISSION
FLORIDA DEPARTMENT OF LAW ENFORCEMENT
DEPARTMENT OF HIGHWAY SAFETY AND MOTOR VEHICLES
DEPARTMENT OF REVENUE
VOLUME II
The above agencies came to be heard before
THE FLORIDA CABINET, Honorable Governor Bush
presiding, in the Cabinet Meeting Room, LL-03,
The Capitol, Tallahassee, Florida, on Tuesday,
September 28, 1999, commencing at approximately
9:15 a.m.
Reported by:
LAURIE L. GILBERT
Registered Professional Reporter
Certified Court Reporter
Certified Realtime Reporter
Registered Merit Reporter
Notary Public in and for
the State of Florida at Large
ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.
100 SALEM COURT
TALLAHASSEE, FLORIDA 32301
850/878-2221
147
APPEARANCES:
Representing the Florida Cabinet:
JEB BUSH
Governor
BOB MILLIGAN
Comptroller
KATHERINE HARRIS
Secretary of State
BOB BUTTERWORTH
Attorney General
BILL NELSON
Treasurer
TOM GALLAGHER
Commissioner of Education
*
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148
September 28, 1999
I N D E X
ITEM ACTION PAGE
BOARD OF TRUSTEES OF THE
INTERNAL IMPROVEMENT
TRUST FUND:
(Presented David B. Struhs,
Secretary)
1 Approved 151
Substitute 2 Approved 209
3 Deferred 211
4 Approved 211
5 Approved 208
6 Approved 212
7 Approved 212
8 Approved 212
9 Approved 217
10 Approved 218
11 Deferred 218
12 Approved 206
Additional 13 Deferred 219
SOUTH FLORIDA WATER MANAGEMENT DISTRICT:
(Presented by Robert Robbins,
Director, Natural Resource Management)
1 Approved 221
FINANCIAL MANAGEMENT INFORMATION BOARD:
(Presented by Martin L. Young,
Secretary)
1 Approved 223
2 Approved 224
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149
September 28, 1999
I N D E X
(Continued)
ITEM ACTION PAGE
ADMINISTRATION COMMISSION:
(Presented by Sandra Sartin,
Policy Coordinator)
1 Approved 225
2 Approved 225
3 Approved 226
4 Approved 226
5 Approved 227
6 Approved 227
7 Approved 227
8 Approved 227
9 Approved 228
10 Approved 230
11 Approved 231
FLORIDA LAND AND WATER
ADJUDICATORY COMMISSION:
(Presented by Teresa Tinker,
Secretary)
1 Approved 232
2 Approved 233
3 Approved 233
FLORIDA DEPARTMENT OF LAW ENFORCEMENT:
(Presented by James T. Moore,
Executive Director)
1 Approved 234
2 Approved 234
ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.
150
September 28, 1999
I N D E X
(Continued)
ITEM ACTION PAGE
DEPARTMENT OF HIGHWAY SAFETY AND MOTOR VEHICLES:
(Presented by Fred O. Dickinson, III,
Executive Director)
1 Approved 242
2 Approved 243
DEPARTMENT OF REVENUE:
(Presented by L.H. Fuchs,
Executive Director)
1 Approved 244
2 Approved 244
CERTIFICATE OF REPORTER 246
*
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September 28, 1999
1 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: I'd like to
2 move --
3 GOVERNOR BUSH: What's next?
4 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: -- move the
5 minutes on the Board of Trustees.
6 GOVERNOR BUSH: Board of Trustees.
7 Secretary Struhs, how are you?
8 MR. STRUHS: Good afternoon.
9 GOVERNOR BUSH: There's a second?
10 Without objection, it's approved.
11 Item Number 2.
12 MR. STRUHS: If it pleases the Board, we
13 would like for you to consider taking Item 12
14 out of order. That is that Tequesta Circle
15 project.
16 What we have for you is a recommended
17 acceptance of a report on the acquisition
18 status of the Brickell Point Limited property
19 in the Tequesta Circle CARL project.
20 Late last evening, a potential deal was
21 reached between the developers and Miami-Dade.
22 We have representatives from both parties here
23 who are interested in sharing --
24 (Treasurer Nelson entered the room.)
25 MR. STRUHS: -- the particulars with you.
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1 I'd remind the Trustees that the last time
2 we dealt with this, the State --
3 (Secretary Harris entered the room.)
4 MR. STRUHS: -- agreed that -- you agreed
5 the State would pay up to 50 percent of the
6 purchase price, or the State's appraised value,
7 whichever is less.
8 In this case, the proposed deal, as I --
9 (Commissioner Gallagher exited the room.)
10 MR. STRUHS: -- understand it, is
11 25 million dollars, which means the lower
12 amount would be half of that, 12.5 million
13 dollars.
14 First up, if it pleases the Board, would be
15 the representative from the development
16 interest, Mr. Michael Baumann; to be followed
17 by the Mayor of Miami, Mayor Penelas.
18 GOVERNOR BUSH: Good afternoon.
19 MR. BRIGHAM: Good afternoon,
20 Governor Bush, Your Honors.
21 My name is Toby Brigham, and I represent
22 the owners of the Brickell Point property,
23 which but for the injunction brought to halt
24 development, would now have a tree on the top
25 of the outside frame; and in the year 2002,
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September 28, 1999
1 would be earning the same rents as the other
2 high-rise twin tower projects in the Brickell
3 area, which would be approximately 10 million
4 dollars a year, or a worth of
5 120 million dollars.
6 The question here is how much of that has
7 been achieved at the time that the property was
8 halted, and the acquisition was proposed?
9 And the valuations of the owners are in the
10 range of 38 million dollars.
11 This purchase price that has been arranged
12 is not 25 million dollars. The cash portion of
13 the purchase price is 25 million dollars, plus
14 attorney's fees and costs of 1.7 million
15 dollars.
16 However, the arrangement that we would hope
17 to achieve a settlement about is -- accepts the
18 acquisition of the property, both by
19 condemnation and 25 million dollars cash, plus
20 attorney's fees and costs; and a charitable
21 gift from the owners, who happen to be the
22 pension plans of four labor unions, as well as
23 the developers.
24 In this case, it's understandable that the
25 State and the community would want to have a
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1 cultural dimension to Miami, which is a major
2 international city.
3 GOVERNOR BUSH: I'm sorry. Charitable
4 gift?
5 Is that the thirty-eight minus the
6 twenty-seven?
7 MR. BRIGHAM: Whatever --
8 GOVERNOR BUSH: There would be a --
9 MR. BRIGHAM: -- whatever the --
10 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- value created --
11 MR. BRIGHAM: -- cash portion has -- is
12 considered a donation by the owners as part of
13 their contribution to the community with
14 others.
15 So that --
16 GOVERNOR BUSH: Hmm.
17 MR. BRIGHAM: -- that the cash portion
18 being paid is but part of the purchase price.
19 And your 15 million dollars of your
20 appraisal, which is of only 400 of the
21 600 units of this planned project, makes that
22 an affordable transaction for everybody, and
23 achieves the public purpose.
24 And, of course --
25 GOVERNOR BUSH: What's the IRS say about
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September 28, 1999
1 that? Just out of curiosity. I've never heard
2 of that. That's pretty interesting.
3 MR. BRIGHAM: I suppose they're saying that
4 they went with the other civic minded citizens
5 that are making cash contributions to this.
6 But there -- there is no doubt -- I mean,
7 the -- the proof of value abounds in the area.
8 But I would also say that sports arenas and
9 stadiums only go so far in that Miami is a
10 major international city. It's understandable
11 how a cultural dimension like this will
12 increase the revenues over the years that come
13 from that circumstance.
14 So we support the request. And it's kind
15 of nice that in this case, working people who
16 take part of their earnings and put it into a
17 pension plan can participate in the same kind
18 of profits as mega corporations who constitute
19 the other owners and developers in the areas,
20 whose properties were not selected for this
21 project.
22 So we would join that request. And I think
23 Mr. Baumann has --
24 MR. STRUHS: Just for the record, I -- I
25 made a mistake. I thought they were speaking
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September 28, 1999
1 in the different order.
2 You just heard from Toby Brigham, and
3 Michael Baumann will follow.
4 Thank you.
5 MR. BAUMANN: Governor, Cabinet, thank you
6 for allowing me the opportunity to appear
7 before you today.
8 I stand here today before you representing
9 the thousands of retirees and pensioners that
10 invested in my company, and in this project,
11 and, frankly, have the retirement accounts at
12 risk as a result of the eminent domain process
13 that's taking place today.
14 We've joined, as recently as last night,
15 approximately 10:00 o'clock, with the County in
16 an attempt to resolve this matter. Trial was
17 scheduled for Monday morning at 9:00 a.m.
18 Part of the things that we are crying out
19 for help for today are as follows: We've lost
20 thousands of jobs, retiree's pension funds have
21 been put at risk --
22 (Attorney General Butterworth exited the
23 room.)
24 MR. BAUMANN: -- and everyone's looking to
25 all the parties involved to come up with a
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1 resolution that is best for all parties. And
2 that includes the taxpayers, the State, the
3 County, and above all, my retirees and partners
4 who invested in me.
5 What we are looking to do is resolve the
6 matter here today with you, and that's why
7 we've asked the State, if possible, to
8 contribute 15 million towards the total package
9 of attempting to resolve this case.
10 What does that mean?
11 What it means to us is that we believe, as
12 a result of all of the focus groups and such,
13 that our jury verdict would be much larger,
14 would be closer to what our appraisals have
15 come in at.
16 Understanding that other appraisals that
17 are much lower have only been done for a
18 portion of the project, not for the entire
19 project which is permitted.
20 What does it also do?
21 It helps save the exposure to the taxpayers
22 of Dade County by avoiding some of the risk
23 that would be involved with regard to a large
24 jury verdict in the event there were no funds
25 available to pay.
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1 What we're trying to do is avoid a
2 litigious outcome that would then be appealed
3 for a year or two. The jobs that have been
4 lost would be for naught. The case would
5 eventually drag on.
6 And whether our lenders would pull out and
7 finally kill the project, thereby increasing
8 the damage exposure to Dade County would only
9 tend to exacerbate what we're dealing with
10 today.
11 So really what we're looking to do today is
12 to try and help all the parties involved. Our
13 contractor put in a lot of time, Soares
14 da Costa in trying to get this job built.
15 (Attorney General Butterworth entered the
16 room.)
17 MR. BAUMANN: They've lost a lot of money.
18 They've agreed to waive a great portion of the
19 they've money lost.
20 The unions have agreed to go to the
21 threshold of what they need, pursuant to
22 Department of Labor and ERISA standards in
23 order to meet and comply with the reasonable
24 and prudent decisions that are required by
25 their advisor.
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1 What we seek here is an end to this
2 nightmare. We came before you approximately
3 seven-and-a-half months ago. And at that time,
4 we all said that we hoped this matter would be
5 tried in June and be over with.
6 We sit here today on the verge of October,
7 and we don't know what the end has for us.
8 So -- so what we sit here today and say is, a
9 bad settlement is a good settlement for all.
10 And what we're asking you for is your help,
11 your guidance, and hopefully our prayers will
12 be answered, and you'll be able to come forth.
13 Thank you.
14 GOVERNOR BUSH: Thank you.
15 Mayor Penelas. Welcome.
16 MR. PENELAS: Governor, members of the
17 Cabinet, good afternoon. It's a pleasure to be
18 here. And thank you very much for your support
19 of the Miami Circle project.
20 You certainly have been very supportive
21 over the course of the last year, and I wanted
22 to come on behalf of the people of
23 Miami-Dade County, and express our
24 appreciation.
25 You've he-- all have heard a lot about the
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1 project. I thought what I would do this
2 morning -- or this afternoon is maybe just
3 update you a little bit on some new
4 developments.
5 And I believe you're being passed out a
6 copy of a Miami Herald article that appeared in
7 this Sunday's newspaper that talks about a
8 very, very exciting potential marriage between
9 the State -- Florida International University
10 and the Kislak Foundation.
11 And basically what you have here at the
12 Miami Circle site, which as you all know, is
13 the most significant archeological find of
14 significance in the -- in south Florida, an
15 opportunity with FIU, who has been wanting to
16 expand the -- their archeological program with
17 an educational and research facility at this
18 site, in addition with the Kislak Foundation's
19 desire to exhibit a very, very substantial
20 collection that they possess.
21 As many of you may know, J. Kislak owns a
22 collection of preColombian and American art and
23 manuscripts, some value anywhere between 40 to
24 50 million dollars.
25 And he is willing, as part of this deal,
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1 and, of course, subject to the
2 Kislak Foundation's Board of Director's
3 approval, to make this marriage possible.
4 We've prepared some renderings for you that
5 basically shows an enclosed glass area where
6 the public would, of course, have access to the
7 Miami Circle, with a building around the
8 circular enclosure that would, of course, house
9 this very substantial collection that
10 Mr. Kislak is willing to donate.
11 The deal basically has the
12 Kislak Foundation and FIU putting up the
13 dollars to build the museum, and a substantial
14 amount of money in an annuity to operate and
15 maintain this museum and this collection for
16 the future.
17 We, of course, as part of our land
18 acquisition deal are also -- are looking at the
19 Kislaks and other private sector partners for
20 contributions towards the land acquisition.
21 But certainly a substantial portion of the
22 land acquisition dollars will be made up by the
23 decision that this Cabinet makes this
24 afternoon.
25 I want to very clearly also state the
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1 County's position, because I want to make sure
2 that there is no misunderstanding as to the
3 County's position.
4 Last evening, I called the Board of County
5 Commissioners into an Executive Session, which
6 as all of you know, is permitted under law to
7 discuss a possible settlement and strategy
8 dealing with this lawsuit.
9 At that time, it was very clear that the
10 sense of the Commission -- although they did
11 not take a formal vote on the item -- the sense
12 of the Commission was to permit me and our
13 County Attorneys to proceed with the settlement
14 of this matter within reasonable terms and
15 conditions.
16 Based on that Executive Session, I spoke to
17 Mr. Baumann less -- late last night, and we did
18 agree to a purchase amount, which I believe has
19 already been represented to the Cabinet.
20 However, I must be very clear that the
21 Board of County Commissioners in their
22 Executive Session, has clearly indicated that
23 the matter must come back to them for a final
24 decision.
25 In other words, if we finalize the
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1 deliberations of the Cabinet today on this
2 issue, I will take the item back, I am very
3 confident that they will approve a settlement
4 as we've stipulated. But I had to make it
5 absolutely clear that I've got to take that
6 matter back to the Board.
7 The Board was also very clear that because
8 of the gap between the potential contribution
9 of the State, and the -- what we call the
10 Safe Neighborhood Parks Bond Program, which
11 voted late yesterday afternoon to make a
12 3 million dollar contribution to this item,
13 that we want to limit, of course, the County's
14 liability as much as possible, as you could all
15 imagine.
16 So we also stand here this afternoon in
17 support of the possibility of a 15 million
18 dollar contribution towards the -- towards the
19 acquisition of the site.
20 GOVERNOR BUSH: Mayor Penelas, can you go
21 through the -- as I understand it, there's a --
22 there is a twenty-six million dollar --
23 twenty-six million seven hundred thousand
24 dollar price. I -- I'm a little confused.
25 Toby, you --
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1 MR. PENELAS: That is correct.
2 GOVERNOR BUSH: I think he may disagree.
3 I mean, the -- you're saying thirty-eight.
4 Is that just for court posturing between the
5 parties in case this doesn't get settled?
6 MR. BRIGHAM: No. The value of the
7 property is that, but the difference between
8 the twenty six seven and thirty-eight is the
9 contribution of the owners stated in the
10 agreement if it should be passed.
11 As a --
12 GOVERNOR BUSH: Can we talk about
13 twenty-six seven just for purposes of -- of
14 discussion here?
15 MR. BRIGHAM: That's the cash portion.
16 Of course.
17 GOVERNOR BUSH: Okay. I don't want to --
18 I'm not a lawyer, fortunately, but I -- so I'm
19 respective of your -- respective of your
20 legal -- potential legal considerations. And
21 I'm assuming that that is why that is being
22 stated. And if I'm wrong, so be it.
23 The twenty-six seven, as I understand it,
24 is the -- the source of payment on this are --
25 you have 3 million dollars that
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1 Miami-Dade County, through its Parks Bond
2 Program will --
3 MR. PENELAS: Yes, sir.
4 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- put up. Miami-Dade
5 School Board is prepared to --
6 MR. PENELAS: I cannot represent that at
7 this time, Governor. We have engaged in
8 preliminary discussions --
9 GOVERNOR BUSH: Okay.
10 MR. PENELAS: -- with the Superintendent,
11 not with members of the Board.
12 GOVERNOR BUSH: So there -- you're asking
13 for fifteen, but there -- there really isn't --
14 other than the fifteen theoretically, and the
15 three that you all have, that's eighteen.
16 There still would be eight million
17 seven hundred thousand left to fund.
18 MR. PENELAS: Under the terms of the
19 agreement, we would have 60 days --
20 GOVERNOR BUSH: Okay.
21 MR. PENELAS: -- to come up with the
22 balance. The developer has also agreed to
23 terms if, in fact, the full amount has not been
24 raised by the end of the 60 days.
25 In effect, we would give them a note for
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1 the difference, and --
2 GOVERNOR BUSH: The County would?
3 MR. PENELAS: Yes. That's -- that's the
4 agreement. Yes, sir.
5 GOVERNOR BUSH: Okay. And --
6 MR. PENELAS: Again, all subject -- I must
7 say, all subject to a final decision by
8 the Board of County Commissioners in an open,
9 public hearing.
10 GOVERNOR BUSH: How -- how does the -- I
11 have a piece of paper here says, the Kislak
12 and Knight Foundations have tentatively
13 committed, subject to approval of their boards,
14 of 4 million dollars for the purchase of the
15 land.
16 And over and above that, J. Kislak and his
17 foundation is committed to doing a -- an --
18 making sure -- having an arrangement with FIU
19 for the --
20 MR. PENELAS: Yes, sir. They've made --
21 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- for the --
22 MR. PENELAS: -- they have made a
23 commitment of, I believe, in the neighborhood
24 of 7 million dollars for the construction of
25 the museum, and for its operation. FIU is
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1 making a similar commitment.
2 Now, at -- as of this -- as of this time,
3 they have not committed any amounts towards the
4 purchase. We believe --
5 GOVERNOR BUSH: Okay.
6 MR. PENELAS: -- it could be a million, it
7 could be two, it could be three million. They
8 have indicated an interest in contributing
9 towards the acquisition, Governor. But I
10 can't --
11 GOVERNOR BUSH: Okay.
12 MR. PENELAS: -- confirm that at this time,
13 because their Board has not met.
14 GOVERNOR BUSH: And the theory, I guess,
15 behind the FIU contribution is this would --
16 this would be the Courtelis Grant Program that
17 they would seek from the State to match for
18 construction.
19 MR. PENELAS: I'm not sure what their
20 source of funding is, Governor.
21 GOVERNOR BUSH: Which is being modified,
22 I think -- at least the Chancellor -- he's
23 not -- is the Chancellor still here?
24 But as I understand it, that would be the
25 source of funding from -- for FIU's portion of
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1 this would be the grant program from the State,
2 which is being modified, I think --
3 MR. PENELAS: And as it relates to the
4 Knight Foundation, which you mentioned, we
5 will, of course, be submitting applications to
6 the Knight Foundation, and many other
7 foundations.
8 But as you all know, that takes a little
9 time to process.
10 GOVERNOR BUSH: Commissioner.
11 TREASURER NELSON: Yes, Governor. As you
12 have so well pointed out in our discussions on
13 this, this has had a community response that
14 has been unparalleled on most local issues; and
15 clearly on almost any archeological issue that
16 I can think of in -- in recent Florida history.
17 So what you just asked the Mayor -- and
18 what the Mayor responded to, as I understand
19 it, Mayor Penelas, you're looking at a package,
20 which from a public policy standpoint, is going
21 to be a community asset in the range of
22 about -- if I total up all of your figures --
23 in the range of 50 to 60 million dollars that
24 is going to be a community asset focused on
25 archeology.
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1 Is that --
2 MR. PENELAS: Commissioner --
3 TREASURER NELSON: -- correct?
4 MR. PENELAS: That is correct. What we
5 have done is we have brought FIU and the
6 Kislak Foundation to the table.
7 Now you all have -- remember, in the CARL
8 program, you all will own the land. So really
9 you all will be in a position to decide if the
10 Kislak Foundation and FIU end up being the
11 eventual tenants of this property, and under
12 what terms and conditions.
13 We are bringing them to the table as value
14 added to what we think will be a spectacular
15 opportunity to provide a showcase to the
16 entrance of Miami, at the Miami -- literally at
17 the mouth of the Miami River where the first
18 notion of international trade and commerce --
19 something I know Secretary Harris is very
20 interested in -- began literally hundreds and
21 hundreds of years ago. I think it will be a
22 real showcase.
23 But eventually, once you all take title to
24 the land, you will decide if it's Kislak, FIU,
25 or whomever else you all decide under your
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1 processes.
2 TREASURER NELSON: And the entities that
3 you have brought to the table, for the record,
4 are Florida International University --
5 MR. PENELAS: Yes, sir.
6 TREASURER NELSON: -- the
7 Kislak Foundation --
8 MR. PENELAS: Yes, sir.
9 TREASURER NELSON: -- the
10 Knight Foundation --
11 MR. PENELAS: The Knight Foundation is not
12 committed as of this moment. We've made an
13 application to them.
14 The only hard commitments are Kislak and
15 FIU for the construction of the museum, and an
16 annuity for its operation and maintenance.
17 We are relatively sure that the
18 Kislak Foundation will also make a contribution
19 towards the acquisition of the property. I
20 cannot confirm at this time how much that would
21 be.
22 TREASURER NELSON: And in round numbers,
23 you're looking at the construction of the
24 museum being in the range of about 10 million.
25 MR. PENELAS: Yes, sir.
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1 TREASURER NELSON: And the operational
2 account, setting aside for the operation of the
3 museum would be about 4 million.
4 MR. PENELAS: Yes, sir.
5 TREASURER NELSON: And then the donation of
6 the art and archeological collection being in
7 the range of somewhere about 40 to 50 million.
8 MR. PENELAS: That is correct.
9 TREASURER NELSON: So you've really done a
10 good night's work putting it all together.
11 MR. PENELAS: Well, a lot of people deserve
12 the credit. Certainly the County Manager has
13 played a critical role in this.
14 And really it was a -- it was a marriage
15 that couldn't have been any better. The
16 Kislaks, as many of you may know, have been
17 looking to -- for a permanent home for their
18 collection for many, many years.
19 In fact, I must admit, they are being wooed
20 by out-of-state interests to take their
21 collection to another state in the
22 United States.
23 So certainly I think it would behoove us to
24 keep them in Florida, and this would be a great
25 site because of the significance it has
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1 historically, the home of the Tequesta Indians.
2 And it always coincides, of course -- it
3 also coincides with Florida International
4 University's desire to expand their academic
5 program. So it's a -- it's really I think a
6 perfect marriage.
7 SECRETARY HARRIS: Commissioner.
8 GOVERNOR BUSH: Katherine.
9 SECRETARY HARRIS: Question about the
10 collection.
11 I had read that it was a -- the Kislak
12 collection is well renowned. And is only a
13 part of it -- I had read the collection is
14 valued at 80 million.
15 Is only a portion of it going to be at FIU,
16 or are they looking at housing their ent--
17 wasn't part of the -- the interest for them to
18 find a museum that would house the entire
19 collection, which is actually sort of unique?
20 MR. PENELAS: Madam Secretary, it is my
21 understanding that the entire collection would
22 be housed there, although they do have portions
23 of their collection that visit different
24 museums throughout the United States.
25 SECRETARY HARRIS: Mayor, is -- well, one
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1 of the most compelling testimonies when we were
2 first looking at this were the Native Americans
3 that came up. And I was told that they're no
4 longer involved.
5 Do you know why they are not involved with
6 the project any longer?
7 MR. PENELAS: They have not expressed an
8 interest. We have tried.
9 And I'll -- I'll be very honest with you,
10 Madam Secretary, I have been very disappointed
11 at the lack of private interest in this issue.
12 I think at the beginning, there was a
13 tremendous outpouring of support from the
14 community. I think there still is a lot of
15 outpouring from the community, per se, to
16 preserve the site.
17 But in terms of hard dollar contributions,
18 we have raised -- we have opened a preservation
19 account. And I'm almost embarrassed to tell
20 you that we've raised less than $8,000 from
21 private sector sources.
22 So I'm very disappointed as a result of
23 that. Nonetheless, I believe it is important
24 for us to preserve this site. There's no doubt
25 about it.
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1 But certainly a lot of people who are
2 making commitments early in the process, and
3 were here before this Cabinet, and were before
4 our County Commission making all sorts of
5 promises, unfortunately, have not come through.
6 That's just the reality.
7 SECRETARY HARRIS: Great.
8 Thank you.
9 GOVERNOR BUSH: General Milligan, do you
10 have any comments?
11 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: No, sir.
12 TREASURER NELSON: Well, Governor, I will
13 make a motion, if we are at that --
14 SECRETARY HARRIS: Are we going to hear
15 from the archeologists?
16 MR. PENELAS: He is here, if you'd like to
17 hear from Mr. Carr. Yes, ma'am.
18 SECRETARY HARRIS: Actually, I guess I -- I
19 would. I didn't know -- I thought it was going
20 to take a little longer. I realize we're
21 moving this time line.
22 I guess my concern is as chief cultural
23 officer, chief historic preservation officer of
24 the state, you know how passionate I was when I
25 came down to Miami, and I said that I would
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1 bring this before the Cabinet, and I --
2 I believed the Cabinet would be responsive, and
3 that we should preserve this site if, indeed,
4 it was truly archeologically significant.
5 And I suppose just from -- from my
6 perspective, there have been so many different
7 views.
8 Now I will vote for the 15 million for the
9 State of Florida to be -- to stand on -- on
10 that commitment if, indeed, it's
11 archeologically significant.
12 And I -- I think my biggest concern is that
13 we haven't been able to be on the property
14 to -- and I understand all the legal
15 ramifications.
16 But we've had some archeologists that
17 say -- and -- and I totally respect Bob Carr as
18 an archeologist, and -- and we have this report
19 from -- from Herschel Shepard, who's renowned,
20 and -- and -- and some others.
21 But I'd also like -- I'd like to hear from
22 Bob Carr, and I haven't had the opportunity,
23 except for about 1 minute outside, to hear from
24 Jim Miller, who's the State archeologist and
25 the Chief of the Bureau of Archeological
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1 Research.
2 I -- I'd like to --
3 MR. PENELAS: Mr. Carr is here.
4 SECRETARY HARRIS: -- hear from them both.
5 That'd be great.
6 (Governor Bush exited the room.)
7 MR. CARR: My name is Bob Carr. I'm
8 working as the archeologist on the Miami Circle
9 project.
10 And basically the question of significance,
11 of course, has been paramount from the
12 beginning. We wouldn't be here, and we
13 wouldn't have gone this far if we weren't
14 absolutely convinced 100 percent that it was
15 archeologically significant.
16 In response to Jim Miller and myself
17 working together, we invited independent
18 scholars to come to the site. All of them have
19 affirmed -- those who have actually inspected
20 the records, the information, the data that has
21 been collected, all of them have categorically
22 stated the site is not only significant on a
23 state level, but probably nationally as well.
24 We have testimony from the Assistant State
25 Geologist. He has looked at it, he's looked at
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1 the carbonate concentrations on the outside of
2 the formations, and he has also categorically
3 stated that this has to be something of great
4 antiquity because for the carbonation to form
5 would take hundreds, if not thousands of years.
6 So I think the -- the septic tank issue,
7 which has haunted us from the beginning is
8 really -- we call it the sceptic tank -- is
9 really a minority opinion. And fortunately
10 it's only big enough for one archeologist.
11 But the -- the fact is, we are absolutely
12 comfortable, without any doubt --
13 (Governor Bush entered the room.)
14 MR. CARR: -- not even a 1 percent doubt
15 that this is not only of prehistoric, and of
16 great antiquity, but of tremendous importance
17 to our state, not only to archeologists and
18 scholars, but to the community, and to
19 Native Americans as well.
20 SECRETARY HARRIS: Of course, that -- as
21 a -- with the Cabinet making this decision, the
22 lowest appraisals have come in at 14 to
23 15 million. Even if we had all the funding to
24 build this great museum, if it's not a -- a
25 archeological site, to pay twenty-six seven
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1 for -- for the site would just be a huge
2 irresponsible move on -- on our part.
3 So I believe that -- I'm not going to speak
4 for the Cabinet -- but that certainly is -- is
5 my greatest concern, to have that -- that type
6 of archeological significance, and the
7 assurance.
8 Could we -- is there anything else -- if
9 you want to say -- I said I wanted to hear from
10 James Miller, the State archeologist, and
11 the --
12 GOVERNOR BUSH: Well, I -- I have one
13 question --
14 SECRETARY HARRIS: Okay.
15 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- which relates to what
16 you're saying, Katherine.
17 That is, as I understand it, no one has
18 been able to get on the site because of the
19 legal dispute.
20 Is there a way for -- in this 60-day
21 period, should there be an agreement for
22 someone to come -- a team to come make the
23 assessment that would give you the satisfaction
24 I think you're concerned about, to validate the
25 great work of the County archeologists.
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1 MR. CARR: Well, we're certain-- we're
2 certainly willing to work with whatever --
3 whoever that is, and -- and focus on the issue
4 in such a way where it doesn't jeopardize the
5 situation of -- of the ownership at this point,
6 because we realize that's part of what the
7 concern is.
8 So I think it could be done.
9 GOVERNOR BUSH: Well, I mean, this is --
10 the reason why you weren't allowed on the site
11 was the owner didn't let you on.
12 MR. CARR: Right.
13 GOVERNOR BUSH: If there's an agreement,
14 I'm --
15 No?
16 MR. BRIGHAM: Mr. Carr was on the site for
17 quite a number of weeks in discovering the
18 circle and making the excavations. Prior to
19 the time it was --
20 GOVERNOR BUSH: Since -- since the
21 litigation.
22 MR. BRIGHAM: Since the litigation.
23 GOVERNOR BUSH: Is that not right, Michael?
24 MR. BAUMANN: Governor, what happened was
25 the judge in the case, Fredricka Smith, decided
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1 that as a result of the injunction being filed
2 against the property, in order to stop all
3 construction whatsoever so that we could not do
4 anything on the site, that nobody should go on
5 the site until the matter would be resolved.
6 GOVERNOR BUSH: Okay.
7 MR. BAUMANN: As you recall, the County
8 came to where you said, we will have this thing
9 done in June or July, it's not a big deal.
10 Obviously that dragged out.
11 So, frankly, what's happened is we are not
12 opposed to allowing Secretary --
13 GOVERNOR BUSH: Well --
14 MR. BAUMANN: -- Harris's --
15 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- I mean, from -- just
16 from the persp-- just common sense would
17 dictate that we would want to get everybody --
18 I mean, J. Kislak, Alex Penelas, the Cabinet,
19 everybody would want to get this verified, and
20 at some point we have to figure out a way to do
21 that and get -- unlawyer this thing up a bit so
22 that --
23 MR. BAUMANN: But that's our problem. We
24 have a trial date scheduled Monday morning. If
25 this matter can't get resolved, that's the
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1 problem, Governor, is that we're sitting here
2 today on the eve --
3 GOVERNOR BUSH: You have trial on -- when?
4 SECRETARY HARRIS: Monday.
5 MR. BAUMANN: Monday. 9:00 a.m.
6 MR. BRIGHAM: And I -- I might suggest also
7 that the Court, and our judicial system, as a
8 matter of res judicata said that this was a
9 significant historic site, of a archeological
10 treasure, to the degree that they allowed the
11 taking of private property.
12 And so there has been an adjudication,
13 notwithstanding any adverse opinions, in a
14 court of law presented with evidence under
15 cross-examination that this is an archeological
16 treasure.
17 GOVERNOR BUSH: Well, with all due respect
18 to a judge, and I -- I'm sure it's a very
19 distinguished person -- he isn't writing the
20 check.
21 SECRETARY HARRIS: Uh-hum.
22 GOVERNOR BUSH: And we have a
23 responsibility to the taxpayers of this state
24 to ensure that what we're buying is the real
25 thing. I mean --
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1 MR. BAUMANN: Governor, I fully appreciate
2 that. The only thing I would --
3 GOVERNOR BUSH: I mean, if it's not the
4 real thing, you'd want to build your building
5 and make all the profits that Toby has
6 envisioned for you.
7 MR. BAUMANN: We would be very -- we would
8 have been happy to do that back in --
9 SECRETARY HARRIS: Governor --
10 MR. BAUMANN: -- January of this year. The
11 only thing we ask for is that -- and
12 unfortunately -- and I understand that this is
13 something that's coming of last minute to the
14 Cabinet.
15 We need to resolve this matter. There's
16 60 days for the County to candidly fish or
17 cut bait. And what we want to do is in order
18 to get there, we will cooperate with them, with
19 the State, and whoever you want us to, in the
20 next 60 days.
21 Because within that 60 days, so that
22 everyone understands, if the County is not
23 successful in finishing out the terms of the
24 agreement, and they have agreed that they will
25 remove the injunction, we can go forward at
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1 that time.
2 So I think there's ample opportunity for
3 everyone to be convinced. And even I will sit
4 here -- stand here before you and tell you that
5 there's been a lot of discussion, I've read the
6 articles as well. But everybody keeps falling
7 on the line it's significant, it's significant.
8 As a developer, I may have different
9 opinions than archeologists. But at the same
10 token, I'm willing to listen to all the
11 opinions, and if I can settle this on behalf of
12 my members and my retirees --
13 GOVERNOR BUSH: Fine.
14 MR. BAUMANN: -- that's my first and
15 foremost concern.
16 GOVERNOR BUSH: Mr. Miller.
17 Secretary Harris, do you have questions
18 of --
19 SECRETARY HARRIS: Oh. Yes.
20 I would -- James Miller is the State
21 Archeologist, and head of the Bureau of His--
22 of Archeological Research?
23 MR. MILLER: (Nodding head.)
24 SECRETARY HARRIS: And I wanted to get his
25 opinions on the table and -- and in the record,
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1 too, please.
2 MR. MILLER: Thank you. Governor Bush,
3 Secretary Harris, members of the Cabinet, I
4 appreciate the opportunity.
5 I am the State Archeologist. Sometimes
6 this is the place where the administration and
7 politics of the state meet the science of
8 archeology.
9 And we're at a place today where some
10 decision is to be made perhaps about the value
11 of a property based on its archeological
12 significance.
13 We have demonstrated, I think, to virtually
14 everyone's satisfaction that this is an
15 archeologically significant site, it is a
16 prehistoric site, it represents the capital
17 town of the Tequesta Indians. There's
18 absolutely no question in my mind about that,
19 and in the mind of most archeologists who have
20 reviewed the evidence and visited the site.
21 That's not an issue.
22 It seems to me that there is a degree of
23 frustration involved here in not being able to
24 have access to the greatest amount of
25 information that could be available in order to
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1 make a decision of this magnitude.
2 You already understand this is a lot of
3 money. For me, as an archeologist, this is
4 more money than I've ever thought about in my
5 life in relation to any archeological
6 undertaking.
7 GOVERNOR BUSH: I imagine.
8 MR. MILLER: This is a lot of archeological
9 money. This is a very important decision.
10 And I -- I couldn't agree more with the
11 concept that the next 60 days be spent on
12 gathering as much information as possible to be
13 able to allow everyone to make the best
14 informed political and technical archeological
15 decision.
16 GOVERNOR BUSH: Apparently we can't, based
17 on the Court -- that this is a -- the Court
18 ruling, the judge's ruling.
19 And during this 60-day period, if there is
20 an agreement in principle, I assume you're
21 going to defer the trial, and wouldn't it be
22 possible for the judge -- to go to the judge on
23 Monday and say, give us 60 days to sort this
24 out, and then we'll be back at you?
25 MR. BAUMANN: Well, unfortunately,
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1 Governor, the next trial date is available
2 not -- until sometime next year, February or
3 March of next year. She is booked completely
4 up.
5 And, unfortunately, that's what we're faced
6 with. And what we are concerned with are ERISA
7 issues. At this point, the Department of
8 Labor.
9 And, frankly, the County has the
10 opportunity within the 60 days, and if
11 Mr. Miller's correct, and Mr. Carr are correct,
12 and all of the individual experts are correct,
13 I'm sure that they can satisfy all the parties'
14 concern, because the State's not going to put
15 up the money until the 60th day, regardless, at
16 that point in time.
17 GOVERNOR BUSH: Well, I'm -- I'm really
18 confused now.
19 You're going to trial on Monday?
20 MR. BAUMANN: Yes, sir.
21 If we don't settle.
22 MR. BRIGHAM: But the settlement --
23 GOVERNOR BUSH: But you don't -- you can't
24 settle because you don't have --
25 MR. BRIGHAM: But the settlement that is
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1 under consideration provides 60 days within
2 which the County has to see if they can raise
3 the money or --
4 GOVERNOR BUSH: Okay.
5 MR. BRIGHAM: -- abandon the suit.
6 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: May I ask a
7 question, Governor?
8 MR. BRIGHAM: So they have 60 days.
9 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: If I
10 understand this thing right, Toby, you're
11 saying that -- you're asking the -- the Board
12 of Trustees to -- to -- to provide you with a
13 check for 15 million dollars.
14 And if this thing turns out to be the --
15 a -- a septic tank, we have just bought a
16 15 million dollar septic tank; is that correct?
17 This Board could not change its mind if it
18 turns out to be not what we believe it to be.
19 Is that -- is that what you're saying?
20 MR. BRIGHAM: No, that's -- that is -- that
21 is not what I intend to be understood.
22 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Just like
23 you want everything on the record, I want
24 everything on the record, too. So --
25 MR. BRIGHAM: Of course.
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1 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: -- go ahead.
2 Okay.
3 MR. BRIGHAM: And we -- we are proposing to
4 arrange a settlement with the County, who is
5 the condemning authority at this point, to
6 conclude the litigation by either a purchase of
7 the property in 60 days; or if they decide not
8 to purchase the property in 60 days, to abandon
9 the suit whereupon the case would proceed to
10 assess delay damages for the fact that the
11 construction was halted seven months ago, which
12 will be considerable.
13 So that if there is any arrangement that
14 you wish to make with the County with regard to
15 the funds that the State may or may not
16 contribute, that's between the -- the State and
17 the County. Because the County, however it may
18 arrange to secure the funding, has 60 days in
19 which to do so, under this settlement.
20 So as I understand the situation is the
21 County has requested that you contribute
22 15 million dollars toward the acquisition,
23 which makes this settlement affordable. And if
24 you wish to condition that upon a 60-day
25 examination, so be it.
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1 As far as the owners are concerned, they
2 are entering into a settlement stipulation now
3 which would give 60 days for whatever reason
4 the County has to proceed or not.
5 And if they decide they do not wish to
6 proceed, then to bring a halt to this taking of
7 property when there's no aspect of expectation
8 that it'll be acquired and put to the public
9 use for which it is, and then proceed with
10 delay damages.
11 So that's -- that's what I intended to
12 convey with what I said.
13 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: That's what
14 I thought you were conveying. That's why I
15 wanted you to put that on the record so
16 everybody can get a real good feel as to
17 what -- what we're -- what we're dealing with
18 here.
19 MR. STRUHS: Members of the Board, there --
20 there is -- is apparently some disagreement as
21 to whether or not the City and County can or
22 cannot have access to the property over the
23 next 60 days.
24 And the attorney for the County,
25 Mr. Tom Goldstein, is here and would be willing
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1 to address that from -- from their point of
2 view as well.
3 GOVERNOR BUSH: Please. Mr. Goldstein,
4 welcome.
5 MR. GOLDSTEIN: Governor, members of the
6 Cabinet, my name is Tom Goldstein. I'm
7 Assistant County Attorney for Dade County
8 handling this matter for the County.
9 Actually, I had made that proposal to the
10 other side early today, that what we would
11 do -- because Mr. Carr had indicated to me that
12 he could get on this property, and within a
13 very short period of time, make the
14 determination that would take care of this
15 issue forever.
16 And that we do that within this 60-day
17 period, that we have agreed that we will use as
18 a settlement for us to cut -- fish or cut bait,
19 so to speak, and that we could do that if the
20 parties would agree. All we need is an
21 agreement.
22 The judge hasn't said, I'm not interested
23 in your agreement. The judge has said,
24 no one's on the property because both parties
25 have said no one should go on the property, and
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1 the judge has agreed.
2 If we go back to the judge and say, we now
3 want you to go ahead on the property, and both
4 parties agree to allow us on the property in
5 the 60-day period, as soon as possible, then we
6 can do that.
7 GOVERNOR BUSH: Yes. Commissioner.
8 TREASURER NELSON: Governor, I'm prepared
9 to make a motion.
10 But I would like for either the Mayor or
11 the Assistant County Attorney in -- in a motion
12 that would obligate the State to the 15 million
13 dollars, what are the conditions vis-a-vis the
14 60-day period as far as the State's 15 million
15 is concerned?
16 MR. PENELAS: Commissioner, I believe you
17 can condition that on the County's decision at
18 the end of the 60 days. We have the right,
19 under this agreement, to walk after 60 days.
20 Assuming the worst case scenario, we don't
21 put all of our financing options -- we don't
22 concrete all of our financing options, we have
23 the right to walk away, or to write a note for
24 the difference.
25 I don't believe that is inconsistent at all
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1 with your desire, and our desire, quite
2 frankly, to send in another archeological team,
3 as Secretary Harris has determined.
4 Because, quite frankly, if your team goes
5 in there and decides this is not of historical
6 significance, we'd be prepared to walk, you're
7 not going to write your 15 million dollar
8 check, and then we'll settle with them delay
9 damages in court.
10 I think it behooves all of us to approve
11 the Secretary's decision.
12 So I would respectfully recommend that your
13 motion be along the lines of the 15 million
14 dollar grant conditioned on obviously the
15 County remaining in the project. And
16 conditioned on allowing one of your
17 archeological teams to go on site.
18 Because if we walk, you're going to walk,
19 too. And a lot of that will be based,
20 obviously, (a), on whether we could afford it
21 and put the monies together; and (b), what this
22 new archeological team discovers.
23 SECRETARY HARRIS: Mr. Mayor --
24 TREASURER NELSON: Governor, I -- I so
25 move.
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1 MR. PENELAS: I'm sorry.
2 TREASURER NELSON: The two conditions as
3 stated --
4 GOVERNOR BUSH: All right.
5 TREASURER NELSON: -- 15 million dollar
6 grant conditioned upon the County continuing to
7 be involved; and conditioned upon our State
8 archeological team to have access, and to give
9 their approval.
10 GOVERNOR BUSH: Is there a second?
11 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: I've got a question,
12 Governor, before that second, since I'm the one
13 that's going to write the warrant eventually.
14 And I am concerned that the County may not
15 walk for fear of what the costs may be
16 associated with their walking, and we could be
17 tabbed with a 15 million dollar bill.
18 And -- and the motion as proposed right now
19 doesn't really afford us the opportunity to
20 withdraw the 15 million if we are not convinced
21 that it meets the archeological standards that
22 we're talking about in this particular project.
23 We -- we -- right now, we are not allowed
24 to walk unless the -- the --
25 GOVERNOR BUSH: Commissioner Nelson.
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1 TREASURER NELSON: The second condition was
2 intended for --
3 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: But not strong
4 enough stated.
5 TREASURER NELSON: State it however you
6 would like, Mr. Comptroller, to protect the
7 interest, as you have indicated. But that was
8 clearly my intention on -- on the second
9 condition.
10 GOVERNOR BUSH: We would both have to be
11 comfortable with the historical significance of
12 this?
13 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Yes. I think
14 that would be --
15 MR. PENELAS: Yes, sir.
16 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: -- and we have
17 the -- we reserve the right to withdraw the
18 15 million dollars if we are not comfortable
19 with --
20 GOVERNOR BUSH: Now --
21 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: -- with their
22 findings.
23 GOVERNOR BUSH: Just before -- before
24 there's a second also, remember that the Board
25 is on record as supporting the -- has -- has
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1 committed to paying for half -- the lower of
2 all of the appraised -- the -- the appraised
3 value on the property, or half of the purchase
4 price.
5 As I understand it right now, this is
6 higher than that. The way I read this, it's
7 twenty-six point seven million divided by --
8 MR. BAUMANN: Not our --
9 GOVERNOR BUSH: I'm talking about our
10 position.
11 MR. BRIGHAM: Okay. May I speak to your
12 position, too, because the arrangement is that
13 the twenty -- that the 25 million is on account
14 of full compensation.
15 It's not an agreement that 25 million is
16 the value of the property. Because the value
17 of the property is -- the contentions of the
18 parties are that the property is worth more --
19 GOVERNOR BUSH: But we have to make an
20 assessment of what we consider to be the
21 valuation of the property for our commitment to
22 be fulfilled.
23 And what the Board has already voted on was
24 the lower of one-half of the total purchase
25 price, and you're -- are you suggesting --
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1 MR. BRIGHAM: I'm saying the purchase price
2 is more than the cash portion.
3 GOVERNOR BUSH: Oh, you're back --
4 MR. BRIGHAM: Or --
5 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- to the contribution
6 thing again.
7 MR. BRIGHAM: Yes, sir.
8 GOVERNOR BUSH: Well, here's how -- I mean,
9 just to put it in perspective for people. What
10 the -- what 15 million dollars is -- now, I
11 realize this has historical significance.
12 But when Michael bought the property,
13 Mr. Baumann bought the property, bought it for
14 eight --
15 MR. BAUMANN: We have approximately
16 fifteen seven invested today.
17 GOVERNOR BUSH: Eight million property for
18 the land.
19 MR. BAUMANN: Right.
20 GOVERNOR BUSH: And we estimated -- the
21 State's appraisal was at 9 million dollars. We
22 estimated that you had 3.8 million. So there's
23 some discrepancy about the capital
24 contributions.
25 And then applying a 15 to 20 percent return
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1 on what you have invested to date, we -- there
2 was additional money. And this all -- and then
3 a developer's profit, and this all comes up to
4 15 million dollars.
5 I mean, that -- that to me is -- given --
6 if we looked at this from the perspective of an
7 apartment -- from the perspective of how you
8 were looking at it, this is an extraordinarily
9 expensive --
10 MR. BAUMANN: Governor, may I --
11 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- piece of property now.
12 MR. BAUMANN: The only difference I would
13 like to bring to your attention, and the
14 members of the Cabinet is the following:
15 The appraisals that were done be-- on
16 behalf of the State, (a), only took into
17 account a portion of the property.
18 The property has a major use special permit
19 for 600 units. Almost all the infrastructure
20 was going in in the phase -- first phase for
21 the entire project, the entire 600 units at one
22 time.
23 That means the ramps, the boardwalks, the
24 landscaping, the sewer, the water, the
25 electric, the amenities, pool, tennis courts,
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1 everything was going in day 1.
2 The second thing that the State's appraisal
3 did not take into account was the market data
4 that was commissioned by Reinhold Wolff
5 Economic Research.
6 They based their rent numbers, which I'm
7 sure the Governor knows quite well, on a number
8 that is not consistent with the Brickell Avenue
9 Corridor. And it just isn't. That's what the
10 numbers are today.
11 So without arguing over the finite details
12 of why the State's appraisal and the
13 developer's appraisal are totally separate and
14 distinct, they are not the same property.
15 What we appraised our property on upon
16 which the lender lent us the money upon which
17 the retirees invested their 10 million dollars
18 in, was predicated upon what the 600 units
19 would do. And, frankly, what property right
20 across the water from us recently sold for
21 $185,000 a unit.
22 So when Swire sold their project this year
23 for 185,000 units, the same thing that we did
24 that's already in existence.
25 What we're trying to do is to come up with
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1 a resolution, I believe, as Mr. Nelson has
2 already indicated, that helps everybody. It
3 doesn't pay us full compensation, because we
4 believe the entire project we are entitled to
5 at this time would be thirty-eight to
6 forty-two million.
7 The County tries to figure out at -- within
8 the 60 days how to amass all the money.
9 GOVERNOR BUSH: Right.
10 MR. BAUMANN: And, in essence, it's not
11 great for everybody, but it's the best we --
12 GOVERNOR BUSH: Well, we're --
13 MR. BAUMANN: -- can do.
14 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- we're faced with -- we
15 have a -- we don't even need a resolution if we
16 accept the notion that the State continues to
17 be committed to half of the purchase price, or
18 the appraised value.
19 If there's no -- if -- if the -- I mean,
20 right now, we are committed.
21 Now --
22 SECRETARY HARRIS: Something.
23 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- either we are suggesting
24 that we're raising that commitment by a certain
25 amount of money, or we're not.
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1 So notwithstanding what the owner of the
2 property is saying, clearly there is a -- an
3 established value that -- that we're
4 discussing.
5 TREASURER NELSON: Well, Governor, I still
6 have the motion. And I would urge my
7 colleagues to support it, given the fact what
8 is the worth of a thing?
9 Governor, the -- the question here, what is
10 the worth of a thing. We've had on one hand,
11 they talk about an appraisal worth
12 38 million dollars based on the 600 per unit --
13 600 unit apartment.
14 On the other hand, you have other
15 appraisals that state different values. We
16 have a former position that says that we will
17 pay the appraisal price or half, whichever is
18 lower.
19 Half of 38 million dollars is more than we
20 are proposing here in this motion.
21 But if you step back from all of that, what
22 is the value to the community, and what is --
23 ought to be the public policy for the State of
24 Florida.
25 And I think as indicated here in the
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1 community participation as outlined by the
2 Mayor in a package worth 50 or 60 million
3 dollars; combined with the testimony of the
4 archeologists, including the State
5 archeologist; combined with the fact that there
6 is an out for the State, pursuant to my motion,
7 60 days from now, it seems to me that the clear
8 interest of the public is for us to proceed,
9 given the fact that they have to know one way
10 or another because they're going into court
11 come Monday morning.
12 GOVERNOR BUSH: Well, we're -- in any case,
13 whether we approve your motion, and we pay
14 fifteen; or we continue with our current
15 commitment, which is, according to what I'm
16 seeing, thirteen million three fifty, based on
17 what -- what we have in front of us, we're
18 committed.
19 I --
20 TREASURER NELSON: Well, is the question --
21 GOVERNOR BUSH: The question is a
22 million dollars -- you know, it's -- the
23 question is -- we made a -- we made a bold
24 commitment --
25 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Yeah.
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1 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- six months ago, I guess
2 it was. And -- and now we would be the only
3 people, other than the -- Miami-Dade that has
4 made a commitment, or soon to make a commitment
5 for 3 million that's actually put real dollars
6 on the table.
7 I don't think anybody could accuse the
8 State of doing anything other than being very
9 cooperative on this.
10 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Governor,
11 the original motion was what, half of the
12 value, or half the purchase -- what was that
13 again?
14 GOVERNOR BUSH: It was -- the -- the
15 appraised -- the lower of the appraised value,
16 or half of the -- of the purchase price.
17 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: I'm --
18 I think the --
19 MR. STRUHS: Gentlemen --
20 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: -- problem
21 we're going to have here is -- is some talk
22 from Mr. Brigham, who's very good, and I wish
23 he'd be donating his legal fee to charity, to
24 make it easier -- which would make it easier to
25 work this out.
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1 But -- but I think the best thing is that
2 we should -- we should have a dollar figure
3 here today, whether it be the 15 million,
4 whether it be the 13 million, I think we should
5 leave here today with the State advising
6 everybody as to what a -- a dollar figure would
7 be.
8 And --
9 MR. STRUHS: Gentlemen, if -- if --
10 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: I don't want
11 to be back here, and it be nineteen.
12 GOVERNOR BUSH: No, I agree.
13 MR. STRUHS: -- and, Madam, if -- if I
14 might just interrupt, and look back at the
15 record of what was actually passed by the Board
16 of Trustees on March 9, earlier this year, what
17 you agreed to was to pay up to the State's
18 appraised value --
19 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Yes.
20 MR. STRUHS: -- or up to 50 percent of the
21 purchase price, whichever is less.
22 And the key distinction there is the
23 State's appraised value, not somebody else's
24 appraised value.
25 GOVERNOR BUSH: Which is 15 million
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1 dollars.
2 MR. STRUHS: Correct.
3 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Is that
4 what --
5 GOVERNOR BUSH: Well, except I -- we're
6 now -- we're now confronted with a
7 38 million dollar purchase price, which is --
8 it's just not -- it's not real. I mean, in all
9 honesty --
10 MR. BAUMANN: We're not asking the State
11 for the 50 percent of the 38 million.
12 GOVERNOR BUSH: No, I know you're not.
13 MR. BAUMANN: We're asking the fifteen --
14 GOVERNOR BUSH: But in order to get to the
15 fifteen, the purchase price, through a very
16 generous contribution of the seller to the --
17 to the buyer, is -- raised the purchase price
18 to get over that threshold level. To get --
19 you know, to get to the 15 million.
20 TREASURER NELSON: Well, may -- may I just
21 make one more try.
22 The March meeting, as articulated by the
23 Secretary of DEP, the motion was either the
24 State's appraised value, which is 15 million --
25 Is that correct, Mr. Secretary?
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1 MR. STRUHS: Yes, sir.
2 TREASURER NELSON: -- or one-half the
3 purchase price.
4 I think the public policy and the public
5 good is sufficient for us to pay the State's
6 appraised value, with the two conditions that
7 the State can opt out.
8 GOVERNOR BUSH: Well, there's a motion.
9 Is there a second?
10 SECRETARY HARRIS: I'll second the motion
11 to go with the State's appraised value with the
12 two options to opt out.
13 GOVERNOR BUSH: The -- the amended -- or
14 the -- the motion that Commissioner Nelson's --
15 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: I have one
16 point of clarification, Governor.
17 I think in Commissioner Nelson's motion, he
18 stated that for the State archaeologist to --
19 to have the opportunity to go on -- on the
20 property.
21 Bill, is that to be limited to just the --
22 the State employees, or -- or anybody who
23 wish -- who the State wishes to bring in, which
24 could be virtually anyone who -- who our
25 experts believe should be able to come in, not
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1 to -- just not to limit it.
2 SECRETARY HARRIS: And -- and with this
3 valuation with the archeol-- archeological
4 team, we'll be able to -- to determine --
5 I mean, the State's value right now is
6 15 million. We might decide that it's -- we
7 might see that it has a much greater value
8 because of the historic significance.
9 But at least we'll have the opportunity to
10 determine that.
11 GOVERNOR BUSH: There's a motion and a
12 second.
13 Is there any more discussion?
14 All -- all in favor?
15 THE CABINET: Aye.
16 MR. PENELAS: Governor, thank you very
17 much, members of the Cabinet.
18 We appreciate your support, and hopefully
19 after the 60-day period, we'll be able to turn
20 this all into reality.
21 Thank you very much.
22 MR. BAUMANN: Thank you all. I appreciate
23 your time.
24 GOVERNOR BUSH: I hope we don't see you
25 again.
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1 MR. BAUMANN: Oh, I hope you do.
2 GOVERNOR BUSH: Item --
3 MR. STRUHS: Members -- members of
4 the Board --
5 GOVERNOR BUSH: I know I did. I just --
6 MR. STRUHS: I --
7 GOVERNOR BUSH: Go ahead.
8 MR. STRUHS: I think for the sake of -- of
9 clarity, it might make sense to proceed to Item
10 Number 5, which is consideration of the interim
11 and second 1999 CARL priority lists.
12 By taking up Item Number 5 now, we can
13 amend that to incorporate the action just
14 taken.
15 GOVERNOR BUSH: I'm sorry, David. Item
16 number -- what are you going to do?
17 SECRETARY HARRIS: Five.
18 GOVERNOR BUSH: Item 5?
19 MR. STRUHS: What -- what I would
20 recommend, just for the sake of clarity, if
21 you -- we jump to Item 5, which is --
22 GOVERNOR BUSH: Okay. Please go ahead.
23 MR. STRUHS: What we're recommending is
24 acceptance of the second 1999 CARL interim
25 report, and approval of the second 1999 CARL
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1 interim priority list.
2 And then I would add, gentlemen, and,
3 Madam, as amended in the previous item.
4 These --
5 GOVERNOR BUSH: Okay.
6 MR. STRUHS: -- have to amend this in order
7 to accomplish what you just --
8 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Move approval as
9 amended.
10 GOVERNOR BUSH: Is there a second?
11 TREASURER NELSON: Second.
12 GOVERNOR BUSH: Moved and seconded.
13 Without objection as amended, it's
14 approved.
15 MR. STRUHS: Thank you.
16 COURT REPORTER GILBERT: Who was the
17 second?
18 GOVERNOR BUSH: Who was the second?
19 Commissioner Nelson.
20 MR. STRUHS: Okay. If we can proceed then
21 to Substitute Item Number 2.
22 GOVERNOR BUSH: Is there a problem?
23 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: No. I
24 just --
25 GOVERNOR BUSH: I mean, we can retake it --
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1 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: No--
2 nobody's here. We have four.
3 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Just barely enough.
4 GOVERNOR BUSH: We have four. We've got
5 enough.
6 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Just --
7 GOVERNOR BUSH: We're -- we're fine so far.
8 MR. STRUHS: That's all you need.
9 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: We need five
10 on some.
11 GOVERNOR BUSH: Go ahead, David.
12 MR. STRUHS: Recommend approval of
13 Substitute Item Number 2.
14 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Move Item 2.
15 GOVERNOR BUSH: Is there a second?
16 Is there a second?
17 TREASURER NELSON: Second.
18 GOVERNOR BUSH: Moved and seconded.
19 Without objection, it's approved.
20 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: That needs
21 five votes; does it not?
22 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: No. That one
23 doesn't, does it?
24 GOVERNOR BUSH: David, Item 3, in the
25 interest of time, we're deferring?
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1 MR. STRUHS: Item --
2 We're counting votes.
3 GOVERNOR BUSH: We have --
4 MR. STRUHS: We have -- we have the votes.
5 Okay.
6 GOVERNOR BUSH: Katherine, you're still
7 here, aren't you?
8 SECRETARY HARRIS: Yes, yes, yes.
9 MR. STRUHS: Okay. So we have five votes
10 for the acquisition?
11 GOVERNOR BUSH: Yeah.
12 MR. STRUHS: If -- if we --
13 GOVERNOR BUSH: If we did.
14 MR. STRUHS: If we could --
15 GOVERNOR BUSH: Everybody voted on
16 Item Number -- what was it?
17 MR. STRUHS: Two.
18 GOVERNOR BUSH: Two.
19 MR. STRUHS: Substitute Item Number 2.
20 All right. Proceeding to Item Number 3, I
21 would recommend at this point we --
22 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: And I -- and I move
23 deferral of Item Number 3.
24 MR. STRUHS: Thank you.
25 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Second that.
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1 GOVERNOR BUSH: Moved and seconded to defer
2 without objection.
3 It's approved.
4 MR. STRUHS: Item Number 4. Recommend
5 approval of Item Number 4, which would
6 authorize the staff to enforce the final
7 judgment of ejectment on Houseboat Row in the
8 Keys.
9 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Motion.
10 GOVERNOR BUSH: Is there a --
11 SECRETARY HARRIS: Second.
12 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- second?
13 SECRETARY HARRIS: Second.
14 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Second.
15 Governor, if I could go back to that
16 deferral. I move that deferral to 9 November.
17 9 November meeting.
18 GOVERNOR BUSH: There's a motion and a
19 second.
20 Any discussion?
21 Without objection, it's approved.
22 MR. STRUHS: That then takes us to Item
23 Number 6. Recommend approval of Item Number 6.
24 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Motion.
25 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Second.
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1 GOVERNOR BUSH: Moved and seconded.
2 Without objection, it's approved.
3 MR. STRUHS: We recommend approval of Item
4 Number 7.
5 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Motion.
6 GOVERNOR BUSH: Is there a motion?
7 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Motion,
8 Wakulla Springs.
9 GOVERNOR BUSH: Second?
10 SECRETARY HARRIS: Second.
11 GOVERNOR BUSH: Moved and seconded.
12 Without objection, it's approved.
13 MR. STRUHS: Recommend approval of Item
14 Number 8.
15 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Motion on
16 Indian River Lagoon.
17 TREASURER NELSON: Second.
18 GOVERNOR BUSH: Moved and seconded.
19 Without objection, it's approved.
20 MR. STRUHS: Item Number 9 is the
21 Julington/Durbin Creek CARL project, one that
22 has been worked on for -- for many years now.
23 In your package in preparation for this
24 meeting, you reserv-- received a copy of a
25 letter, Exhibit B.
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1 Since receiving that document, the parties
2 have proposed to take another route. And in
3 place of that letter, they have agreed to the
4 establishment of an escrow account for the
5 State's portion of that acquisition.
6 In order to explain the reasons and the
7 rationale why, I'd like to introduce, if it
8 pleases you, Mr. Hainline -- Hainline --
9 Mr. T.R. Hainline, representing the developer.
10 GOVERNOR BUSH: Isn't the Mayor of
11 Jacksonville here as well?
12 MR. STRUHS: Yes. Mayor Delaney is -- is
13 also here, as is Henry Dean, the
14 Executive Director of the Water Management
15 District.
16 GOVERNOR BUSH: Please. Welcome, Mayor.
17 (Commissioner Gallagher entered the room.)
18 MR. HAINLINE: Governor, I'd be happy to
19 defer to the Mayor to speak first.
20 GOVERNOR BUSH: I'd like -- you should.
21 MR. HAINLINE: Yes.
22 GOVERNOR BUSH: Smart guy.
23 MR. DELANEY: Governor, I appreciate it.
24 This again is -- as the Secretary
25 mentioned, has been a project that over the
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1 last generation, has been sought by the State,
2 local environmental activists in our community.
3 Over a generation, it is regarded as really
4 one of the three most environmentally sensitive
5 and important areas in the St. Johns River
6 Water Management watershed, which, as you know,
7 extends about 250 miles along the eastern
8 seaboard.
9 We believe that we have finally put
10 together a -- an arrangement that
11 fortunately -- hopefully is a little more
12 simple than the deal that you just had to go --
13 address.
14 Essentially what we have in this case is
15 a -- a value that is below the original
16 appraised value --
17 GOVERNOR BUSH: What percentage below the
18 appraisal -- appraised value?
19 MR. DELANEY: I would say it's about
20 15 percent below. I think it was 20 million
21 dollar appraised value --
22 GOVERNOR BUSH: I just need --
23 MR. DELANEY: -- 17 million --
24 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- to hear that to make
25 my -- feel more --
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1 MR. DELANEY: Well, we've also got a few
2 other -- few other bonuses in there, Governor.
3 This one, the County is putting up a
4 quarter of the price, the Water Management
5 District a quarter, and -- and we are seeking
6 pursuant to the CARL guidelines approximately
7 half of that price.
8 Further, in terms of the appraised values,
9 essentially the private sector originally
10 purchased this land for development purposes.
11 And so we are, in effect, stepping in their
12 shoes as to this portion. It's roughly half of
13 a -- of a larger tract that they're seeking to
14 develop.
15 So, again, I think in terms of the
16 appraisals and then the percentages, I think
17 they're fair all the way around, and would be a
18 wonderful addition to the state.
19 Further, although, I think three-quarters
20 of it is titled in the state, one quarter in
21 the Water Management District. The District
22 and the City of Jacksonville will be managing
23 it, so there is no longer term exposure to the
24 State.
25 GOVERNOR BUSH: Excellent.
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1 Thank you, Mayor.
2 MR. DELANEY: With that, again I also
3 appreciate -- I think we've gotten letters from
4 most of the -- most of the Secretaries and the
5 Cabinet with supporting this.
6 And we do appreciate your -- your help and
7 your patience.
8 GOVERNOR BUSH: Thank you.
9 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Governor, if I
10 might --
11 Some further discussion?
12 GOVERNOR BUSH: What's that?
13 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: David, any further
14 discussion?
15 MR. STRUHS: No, sir.
16 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: No?
17 Unle-- the -- you know, this -- this
18 process is a little different than the normal
19 course of business that we do in the State.
20 And I am quite confident that the Treasurer
21 agrees with me that this -- any language that
22 we have in this agreement, or the -- the escrow
23 needs to reflect and protect the constitutional
24 aspects of the Treasurer's office and -- and
25 Controller's office.
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1 And so I would move approval based on the
2 assurance that both the Treasurer and I are
3 afforded the opportunity to review the language
4 in the agreement, and in the -- or escrow, and
5 that -- subject to our constitutional
6 requirements.
7 TREASURER NELSON: I agree with the
8 Comptroller, and I second the motion.
9 GOVERNOR BUSH: There's a motion and
10 second.
11 Any more discussion?
12 Without objection, it's approved.
13 Thank you, Mayor.
14 Thank you, Mr. Hainline.
15 MR. STRUHS: Thank you, General Milligan,
16 for that.
17 From now on, I will always introduce mayors
18 first, regardless of what my -- regardless of
19 what my notes say.
20 TREASURER NELSON: You're learning.
21 GOVERNOR BUSH: Item 10.
22 MR. STRUHS: We recommend approval of Item
23 Number 10.
24 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Motion on 10.
25 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Second.
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1 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Second.
2 GOVERNOR BUSH: Moved and seconded.
3 Without objection, it's approved.
4 MR. STRUHS: We're going to recommend
5 deferral of --
6 No, I'm sorry, Item Number 11.
7 Item number 11 is a discussion item.
8 There is no decision at this point. If --
9 GOVERNOR BUSH: Secretary Harris would like
10 to defer this item.
11 SECRETARY HARRIS: And if --
12 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Second.
13 SECRETARY HARRIS: If we could just have
14 staff look at the -- the consideration formula
15 for the next Cabinet meeting, we can discuss
16 that.
17 MR. STRUHS: We'd be happy to. Thank you.
18 SECRETARY HARRIS: Thank you.
19 GOVERNOR BUSH: There's a motion --
20 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Second.
21 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- to defer.
22 Second.
23 Without objection, it's approved.
24 MR. STRUHS: And given that it's
25 1:00 o'clock, I would recommend you consider
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1 deferring Item Number 13 as well.
2 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Move deferral.
3 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: What about 12?
4 GOVERNOR BUSH: We already did --
5 MR. STRUHS: No. We already did 12.
6 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: I'm sorry.
7 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Do you want
8 to do it again?
9 GOVERNOR BUSH: No.
10 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: I missed it.
11 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Thank you.
12 GOVERNOR BUSH: There's a motion and a
13 second to defer.
14 Without objection, it's approved.
15 MR. STRUHS: And -- and --
16 GOVERNOR BUSH: Commissioner Nelson wanted
17 to redo it one more time.
18 MR. STRUHS: Is it -- is it, just for the
19 record, clear that all these items are being
20 deferred to November 9.
21 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Certainly that --
22 GOVERNOR BUSH: Just the --
23 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: -- last deferable --
24 deferral was to November 9th.
25 GOVERNOR BUSH: We'll leave that up to you
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1 all to determine when the --
2 MR. STRUHS: Okay.
3 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- the -- other than the
4 first one, which we're on record on. I don't
5 know --
6 MR. STRUHS: Thank you.
7 (The Board of Trustees of the Internal
8 Improvement Trust Fund Agenda was concluded.)
9 *
10
11
12
13
14
15
16
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
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SOUTH FLORIDA WATER MANAGEMENT DISTRICT 221
September 28, 1999
1 GOVERNOR BUSH: What is next?
2 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: SWFWMD?
3 GOVERNOR BUSH: Overdose of paper here.
4 South Florida Water Management District.
5 (Comptroller Milligan exited the room.)
6 GOVERNOR BUSH: Please --
7 MR. ROBBINS: This item is a request to
8 exchange one-half acre of privately owned lands
9 in Florida Bay for .13 acres of sovereign
10 submerged lands currently contained within a
11 salt water swimming pool.
12 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Motion.
13 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Second.
14 GOVERNOR BUSH: There's a motion and a
15 second.
16 Any discussion?
17 It's a very unusual request. We don't get
18 many of these.
19 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Not many people,
20 do we own half their swimming pool either.
21 GOVERNOR BUSH: Exactly.
22 Without objection, it's approved.
23 Thank you for your patience.
24 (The South Florida Water Management
25 District Agenda was concluded.)
ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.
FINANCIAL MANAGEMENT INFORMATION BOARD 222
September 28, 1999
1 GOVERNOR BUSH: Financial Management
2 Information Board.
3 Is there a motion on the minutes?
4 TREASURER NELSON: We have to have the
5 Comptroller --
6 GOVERNOR BUSH: Oh.
7 TREASURER NELSON: -- but since he's not
8 here, you and I can do it.
9 GOVERNOR BUSH: Okay.
10 TREASURER NELSON: So I will move them.
11 GOVERNOR BUSH: I'll second them.
12 TREASURER NELSON: Do we have to have --
13 GOVERNOR BUSH: Commissioner --
14 TREASURER NELSON: -- all three of us here?
15 I don't think we do.
16 MR. YOUNG: No. Just two.
17 TREASURER NELSON: Okay.
18 GOVERNOR BUSH: Just two. Everybody's
19 pointing two.
20 TREASURER NELSON: All right.
21 GOVERNOR BUSH: Item 2.
22 (Comptroller Milligan entered the room.)
23 TREASURER NELSON: Well, he's back.
24 Okay. So I move the -- the minutes.
25 GOVERNOR BUSH: Is there a sec--
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1 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: And I second them.
2 GOVERNOR BUSH: Moved and seconded.
3 Without objection, it's approved.
4 MR. YOUNG: Item 2, approval of the revised
5 Strategic Plan.
6 TREASURER NELSON: And I will move the
7 Strategic Plan.
8 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: And -- and I'll
9 second it.
10 And I think I need to point out that,
11 you know, this is really a -- a change in terms
12 of the business case that we're looking at for
13 financial -- integrated financial management is
14 a -- a very important issue that is going down
15 the pike right now. And a very important part
16 of the future of the state of Florida I think.
17 GOVERNOR BUSH: Very important.
18 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: And this is a --
19 an -- a very important item, even though we
20 kind of drifted through it --
21 GOVERNOR BUSH: Well, and --
22 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: -- very rapidly.
23 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- and we -- as you recall,
24 we stopped a path that would have led to a very
25 expensive process.
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1 And that's -- I actually think it's good
2 that we could admit that it wasn't working out,
3 and --
4 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Exactly.
5 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- and change direction.
6 Showing that kind of flexibility in
7 government's a good thing.
8 So we're counting on Secretary McGurk and
9 the team coming up with an alternative for the
10 Legislature, I guess by January?
11 MR. YOUNG: Yes, sir.
12 GOVERNOR BUSH: There's a motion and a
13 second.
14 Without objection, it's approved.
15 MR. YOUNG: Thank you. That concludes --
16 GOVERNOR BUSH: Thank you.
17 (The Financial Management Information Board
18 Agenda was concluded.)
19 *
20
21
22
23
24
25
ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.
ADMINISTRATION COMMISSION 225
September 28, 1999
1 GOVERNOR BUSH: Administration Commission.
2 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Motion on the
3 minutes.
4 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Second.
5 GOVERNOR BUSH: Moved and seconded.
6 Without objection, it's approved.
7 Item 2.
8 MS. SARTIN: Request approval of a transfer
9 of general revenue for Agency for
10 Health Care Administration.
11 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Motion.
12 GOVERNOR BUSH: Is there a second?
13 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Second.
14 GOVERNOR BUSH: Moved and seconded.
15 Without objection, it's approved.
16 MS. SARTIN: Item 3 is a request for a
17 transfer of general revenue appropriations for
18 Department --
19 GOVERNOR BUSH: Can you --
20 MS. SARTIN: -- of Children --
21 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- Sandy, can you --
22 MS. SARTIN: -- and Families.
23 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- get closer to the mic?
24 MS. SARTIN: Okay.
25 GOVERNOR BUSH: Because there's a --
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1 MS. SARTIN: Can you hear me now?
2 GOVERNOR BUSH: I can.
3 MS. SARTIN: Yeah.
4 GOVERNOR BUSH: There's a motion.
5 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Motion on 3.
6 SECRETARY HARRIS: Second.
7 GOVERNOR BUSH: Second.
8 Without objection, it's approved.
9 MS. SARTIN: Item 4 is a request for a
10 pur-- for a transfer of general revenue
11 appropriations for the State Court System and
12 Department of Elder Affairs.
13 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Motion.
14 GOVERNOR BUSH: Second?
15 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Somebody.
16 GOVERNOR BUSH: Is there a second?
17 SECRETARY HARRIS: Second.
18 GOVERNOR BUSH: Moved and seconded.
19 Without objection, it's approved.
20 MS. SARTIN: Item 5 is a request for an
21 information resource technology project for the
22 Department of Health.
23 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Motion.
24 SECRETARY HARRIS: Second.
25 GOVERNOR BUSH: Moved and seconded.
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September 28, 1999
1 Without objection, it's approved.
2 MS. SARTIN: Item 6 is a request for a
3 transfer of general revenue appropriation for
4 Department of Health.
5 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Motion.
6 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Second.
7 GOVERNOR BUSH: Moved and seconded.
8 Without objection, it's approved.
9 MS. SARTIN: Item 7 is a request for
10 approval to establish 19 positions and transfer
11 of appropriation for Department of
12 Juvenile Justice.
13 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Motion.
14 SECRETARY HARRIS: Second.
15 GOVERNOR BUSH: Moved and seconded.
16 Without objection, it's approved.
17 MS. SARTIN: Item 8 is a request of
18 transfer of positions and appropriations for
19 Departments of Labor and Employment Security,
20 Management Services, and Children and Families.
21 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Motion.
22 SECRETARY HARRIS: Second.
23 GOVERNOR BUSH: Moved and seconded.
24 Without objection, it's approved.
25 MS. SARTIN: Item 9 is a request to
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1 establish 14 positions for the Department of
2 Legal Affairs.
3 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Motion.
4 GOVERNOR BUSH: Moved and --
5 SECRETARY HARRIS: Second.
6 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Second.
7 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- seconded.
8 Without objection, it's approved.
9 MS. SARTIN: Item 10 is a request for
10 approval, transfer of general revenue --
11 (Secretary Harris exited the room.)
12 MS. SARTIN: -- appropriations from
13 administered funds to the Division of
14 Universities for purchase of surveillance
15 cameras for Florida A&M University.
16 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Motion.
17 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Second.
18 GOVERNOR BUSH: Is there a second?
19 This is in response to the bombings,
20 Commissioner Nelson, yes-- last week. And the
21 money was delivered on Friday, and
22 President Humphries has the money, and
23 I believe hopefully today the cameras are --
24 are starting to be installed.
25 Commissioner Moore is also today, I think,
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ADMINISTRATION COMMISSION 229
September 28, 1999
1 going to show some billboards -- correct me if
2 I'm wrong. Is that going to happen? Is it
3 raining outside?
4 MR. MOORE: We hope it happens today. It
5 certainly will in the next couple of days,
6 outside --
7 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- where we -- we have a
8 $25,000 bounty for the perpetrator of this
9 incredibly ugly crime.
10 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Is that
11 higher yet, Governor? I had --
12 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: It's higher.
13 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: -- heard,
14 of course, it may be higher now with --
15 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Yeah. It's 60,000 I
16 heard this morning.
17 GOVERNOR BUSH: Is it sixty?
18 MR. MOORE: Governor, we confirmed $25,000
19 that we put on the table. But if you total it
20 up --
21 GOVERNOR BUSH: Okay. This is --
22 MR. MOORE: -- the sum --
23 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- the combined --
24 MR. MOORE: -- has yet to come. We don't
25 have that money.
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ADMINISTRATION COMMISSION 230
September 28, 1999
1 GOVERNOR BUSH: It's kind of like the
2 Miami Circle --
3 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Yeah.
4 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- funding.
5 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: It's floating.
6 GOVERNOR BUSH: And then finally, we've --
7 we've made a commitment for increased
8 law enforcement 24-hours seven days a week on
9 campus.
10 So we have responded very quickly. And I,
11 coincidently, was with Attorney General Reno
12 the day after this, and -- and briefed her on
13 it.
14 And she is -- was very supportive, and --
15 and hopefully will turn that support into some
16 meaningful financial support and manpower to
17 find this person. So that's the latest.
18 Is there a motion?
19 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: We did. It's --
20 GOVERNOR BUSH: Second?
21 Did I already --
22 Without objection, it's approved.
23 MS. SARTIN: Item 11 is a request for
24 approval for repeal of certain
25 Administration Commission rules that have been
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ADMINISTRATION COMMISSION 231
September 28, 1999
1 determined to be obsolete.
2 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Motion.
3 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Second.
4 GOVERNOR BUSH: Moved and seconded.
5 Without objection, it's approved.
6 (The Administration Commission Agenda was
7 concluded.)
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FLORIDA LAND AND WATER ADJUDICATORY COMMISSION 232
September 28, 1999
1 GOVERNOR BUSH: The Florida Land and Water
2 Adjudicatory -- I can never pronounce -- that's
3 a word I'll never be able to pronounce --
4 Commission.
5 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: You did it
6 perfectly.
7 Motion on the minutes.
8 GOVERNOR BUSH: Oh, I think I killed it
9 again.
10 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Move the minutes.
11 GOVERNOR BUSH: There's a motion of the
12 minutes.
13 Second?
14 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Second.
15 GOVERNOR BUSH: Moved and seconded.
16 Without objection, it's approved.
17 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: That's why
18 we use letters --
19 MS. TINKER: Item 2, recommend approval of
20 the proposed final rule establishing the
21 Poinciana Community Development District in
22 Polk County.
23 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Motion.
24 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Second.
25 GOVERNOR BUSH: Is there a second?
ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.
FLORIDA LAND AND WATER ADJUDICATORY COMMISSION 233
September 28, 1999
1 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Second.
2 GOVERNOR BUSH: Any discussion?
3 Moved and seconded.
4 Without objection, it's approved.
5 MS. TINKER: Item 3, recommend approval to
6 amend Rule 42O-1.001, relating to the
7 establishment of the Cypress Grove Community
8 Development District.
9 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Motion.
10 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Second.
11 GOVERNOR BUSH: Moved and seconded.
12 Without objection, it's approved.
13 (The Florida Land and Water Adjudicatory
14 Commission Agenda was concluded.)
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FLORIDA DEPARTMENT OF LAW ENFORCEMENT 234
September 28, 1999
1 GOVERNOR BUSH: Florida Department of Law
2 Enforcement.
3 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Motion on the
4 minutes.
5 GOVERNOR BUSH: Thank you for your
6 patience, Commissioner Moore.
7 MR. MOORE: Yes, sir.
8 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Move the
9 minutes.
10 MR. MOORE: Thank you, Governor.
11 GOVERNOR BUSH: There's --
12 Moved and seconded.
13 Without objection, it's approved, the
14 minutes.
15 Item 2.
16 (Secretary Harris entered the room.)
17 MR. MOORE: Item 2 is the Department's
18 2000-2001 proposed Legislative Budget Request.
19 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Motion.
20 SECRETARY HARRIS: Second.
21 GOVERNOR BUSH: Moved and seconded.
22 I withhold my vote as Governor in order to
23 make my own budget recommendations.
24 Everybody else voted yes.
25 MR. MOORE: Thank you.
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FLORIDA DEPARTMENT OF LAW ENFORCEMENT 235
September 28, 1999
1 GOVERNOR BUSH: Thank you.
2 (The Florida Department of Law Enforcement
3 Agenda was concluded.)
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DEPARTMENT OF HIGHWAY SAFETY AND MOTOR VEHICLES236
September 28, 1999
1 GOVERNOR BUSH: Item 1.
2 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Highway Safety.
3 MR. DICKINSON: Governor, submission of the
4 Department's Legislative Budget Request for
5 2000-2001.
6 That includes, incidentally , a 10 percent
7 across-the-board pay hike for our sworn
8 personnel, Florida Highway Patrol, as well as
9 some additional troopers.
10 All of our budget requests with regard to
11 positions are regarding -- are directly related
12 to law enforcement. And everything else is for
13 our customer service.
14 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Motion.
15 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Question,
16 Governor.
17 GOVERNOR BUSH: Yes.
18 SECRETARY HARRIS: Second.
19 GOVERNOR BUSH: General Butterworth.
20 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Fred, with
21 that 10 percent, how much would that be for a
22 starting trooper in north Florida?
23 MR. DICKINSON: Currently, they're at
24 twenty-six eight. So tack on another 2500 to
25 that, that'd be right at -- a little over
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DEPARTMENT OF HIGHWAY SAFETY AND MOTOR VEHICLES237
September 28, 1999
1 30,000.
2 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Is that
3 south Florida, the same number, or is it --
4 MR. DICKINSON: No, sir.
5 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: -- a little
6 bit higher?
7 MR. DICKINSON: In South Florida, you would
8 put a $5,000 CAD in those four CAD counties.
9 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Now, how
10 will that put you comparatively for starting
11 off with other agencies? That should put you
12 pretty good, doesn't it?
13 MR. DICKINSON: Yes, sir. Actually it
14 would put us -- right now -- we send a little
15 sheet around.
16 We're 15th among some of our top
17 law enforcement agencies in the state. If we
18 got that 10 percent, that would put us probably
19 in pretty good -- we'd be up in the ninth,
20 tenth category.
21 With the CAD in south Florida, we'd be very
22 competitive with your south Florida law
23 enforcement --
24 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Governor,
25 with the trooper that -- that we honored
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DEPARTMENT OF HIGHWAY SAFETY AND MOTOR VEHICLES238
September 28, 1999
1 earlier today has been with you how long, about
2 eight years now, Fred?
3 MR. DICKINSON: Eight years.
4 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: And how --
5 how much would he be making as an eight-year --
6 as an eight-year trooper?
7 MR. DICKINSON: He probably has received --
8 four or -- he has not had any special pay
9 increase, other than --
10 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: It's just --
11 so he'd be making the same amount of money as
12 a -- as a regular new trooper coming aboard --
13 MR. DICKINSON: No, sir.
14 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: -- with a
15 couple -- with a couple pay steps.
16 MR. DICKINSON: He -- he got a two-step pay
17 increase last year, because we are now bringing
18 our troopers in at a Step 3.
19 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Okay.
20 MR. DICKINSON: But he's -- he's right at
21 that 26,000.
22 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: So he's at
23 the same number -- your eight-year trooper is
24 at the same amount of money that the new
25 trooper coming in.
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DEPARTMENT OF HIGHWAY SAFETY AND MOTOR VEHICLES239
September 28, 1999
1 MR. DICKINSON: That's correct.
2 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: And that
3 eight-year trooper who we honored today could
4 go with 14 different other law enforcement
5 agencies, and make more money starting off
6 today.
7 It is absolutely amazing, Governor, that we
8 do keep the people --
9 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: That you have
10 anybody.
11 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: -- that we
12 do in the Florida Highway Patrol.
13 GOVERNOR BUSH: Actually, the turnover's
14 quite low.
15 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: It is.
16 Because you have people like the trooper
17 that was -- that was -- that was honored here
18 today.
19 And I think we really owe it to them to --
20 to pay them something that is -- that is --
21 that they should be getting paid.
22 And a starting off trooper should not get
23 paid the same amount of money as -- as an
24 eight-year definite hero.
25 If there's some way, Governor, I don't know
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DEPARTMENT OF HIGHWAY SAFETY AND MOTOR VEHICLES240
September 28, 1999
1 how it could be done, but -- to somehow to tie
2 more troopers, and -- and bring some money out
3 of -- out of DOT trust funds, if anything is
4 available there, through the -- the present
5 gasoline tax.
6 And if we can -- if we can buy roads -- buy
7 road right-of-way smarter, we can save untold
8 amount of money, and -- and I don't -- and
9 since the troopers patrol the roads anyway,
10 great sources of money maybe should be from
11 that -- the gas tax.
12 If, in fact, there's enough gas tax there
13 to do it. It's a -- what are you, a hundred
14 and twenty -- hundred and twenty-five million
15 general revenue?
16 MR. DICKINSON: Yes, sir.
17 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: We may very
18 well be able to -- to have a real good -- by
19 doing things right, I think we maybe we can add
20 additional troopers and -- and additional
21 salaries.
22 GOVERNOR BUSH: Last year we -- we added
23 additional troopers. We got stalled on the
24 1 yard line for increased pay --
25 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Right.
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DEPARTMENT OF HIGHWAY SAFETY AND MOTOR VEHICLES241
September 28, 1999
1 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- and it got tripped up
2 into the larger collective bargaining issues
3 for all State law enforcement officers, which
4 may occur again, I don't know.
5 But it's something that's high on my
6 priority since I was committed in the campaign,
7 I'm trying to fulfill every campaign promise as
8 quickly as I can.
9 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: And by the way, the
10 number of troopers, too, is woefully below what
11 is really needed. It's about all that they can
12 train, I guess.
13 Is that a fair statement, Fred?
14 MR. DICKINSON: Yes, sir. Very fair.
15 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: They could use --
16 MR. DICKINSON: And --
17 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: -- another four or
18 five hundred, in fact, and --
19 MR. DICKINSON: We could. We'd be glad to
20 do every crash in the state with that --
21 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Yeah.
22 MR. DICKINSON: -- which will -- which
23 would take the burden off of --
24 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Well, that --
25 MR. DICKINSON: -- our local Sheriffs.
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DEPARTMENT OF HIGHWAY SAFETY AND MOTOR VEHICLES242
September 28, 1999
1 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: -- there was a study
2 done, a very effective study, that indicated
3 they were 500 plus short in troopers.
4 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Governor,
5 today, I believe there's only approximately
6 100 more troopers today than when I was over
7 head of the agency that Fred's the head of now.
8 And I -- and I left it -- I left the agency
9 16 years ago. So that's -- obviously --
10 MR. DICKINSON: Doing more with less,
11 Governor.
12 GOVERNOR BUSH: You're doing a good job.
13 Is there --
14 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: I was
15 doing --
16 GOVERNOR BUSH: -- a motion --
17 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: -- a good
18 job -- I was doing a good job, too, Governor.
19 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: I move the budget --
20 GOVERNOR BUSH: You're doing a great job.
21 There's a motion and a -- and a second.
22 All in favor.
23 THE CABINET: Aye.
24 GOVERNOR BUSH: I withhold my vote as
25 Governor in order to make my own budget
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DEPARTMENT OF HIGHWAY SAFETY AND MOTOR VEHICLES243
September 28, 1999
1 recommendations.
2 I think that's it.
3 MR. DICKINSON: Item 2 --
4 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Item 2.
5 GOVERNOR BUSH: I'm sorry. Item 2.
6 MR. DICKINSON: -- submission of our
7 2000 legislative requests subject --
8 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Motion on 2.
9 MR. DICKINSON: -- on the legislation.
10 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Motion
11 GOVERNOR BUSH: Is there a second?
12 SECRETARY HARRIS: Second.
13 GOVERNOR BUSH: Moved and seconded.
14 Without objection, it's approved.
15 Thank you, Fred.
16 MR. DICKINSON: Thank you, Governor,
17 Cabinet.
18 (The Department of Highway Safety and Motor
19 Vehicles Agenda was concluded.)
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ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.
DEPARTMENT OF REVENUE 244
September 28, 1999
1 GOVERNOR BUSH: Department of Revenue.
2 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Motion on the
3 minutes.
4 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Second.
5 GOVERNOR BUSH: Moved and seconded.
6 Without objection, it's approved.
7 MR. FUCHS: Item 2 is a request for
8 approval of and authority to enter into
9 contracts with 15 CPA firms for the performance
10 of compliance audits pursuant to
11 Section 213.28.
12 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Motion.
13 SECRETARY HARRIS: Second.
14 GOVERNOR BUSH: Moved and seconded.
15 Without objection, it's approved.
16 MR. FUCHS: Thank you.
17 GOVERNOR BUSH: You're welcome.
18 COMMISSIONER GALLAGHER: Waited all day --
19 ATTORNEY GENERAL BUTTERWORTH: Was it worth
20 the wait?
21 GOVERNOR BUSH: Thank you.
22 MR. FUCHS: It's always worth the wait,
23 Governor.
24 COMPTROLLER MILLIGAN: Is that the end?
25 We are finished?
ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.
DEPARTMENT OF REVENUE 245
September 28, 1999
1 (The Department of Revenue Agenda was
2 concluded.)
3 *
4 (The Cabinet meeting was concluded at
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ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.
246
September 28, 1999
1 CERTIFICATE OF REPORTER
2
3
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5 STATE OF FLORIDA:
6 COUNTY OF LEON:
7 I, LAURIE L. GILBERT, do hereby certify that
8 the foregoing proceedings were taken before me at the
9 time and place therein designated; that my shorthand
10 notes were thereafter translated; and the foregoing
11 pages numbered 146 through 245 are a true and correct
12 record of the aforesaid proceedings.
13 I FURTHER CERTIFY that I am not a relative,
14 employee, attorney or counsel of any of the parties,
15 nor relative or employee of such attorney or counsel,
16 or financially interested in the foregoing action.
17 DATED THIS 7TH day of OCTOBER, 1999.
18
19
20 LAURIE L. GILBERT, RPR, CCR, CRR, RMR
100 Salem Court
21 Tallahassee, Florida 32301
850/878-2221
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ACCURATE STENOTYPE REPORTERS, INC.
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Cabinet
Affairs
